Night Vfr

[gannet]

Please educate me. I see a spirited debate on night VFR on another thread and find myself scratching my head. My military background had plenty of night VFR, and a large part of it was before NVGs. Pre NVG, my limits for night were hard 1000'/3 miles no matter who was in trouble for SAR (the old boatload of pregnant nuns would have been out of luck), training limits were higher. Is this a question of regulations in civilian aviation or personal choice. As long as minimum equipment requirements are met, isn't night VFR a legal option as long as the pilot is rated? Or is this a single vs multi engine argument?

[Thumper2]

Not sure how much of a help I will be here but here I go (if I make a mistake, please don't crusify me):

 

1) Must have TC approval on your ops spec.

 

2) Single engine night is only for ferry essential AIR CREW non revenue flights.

 

3) If flying passengers A/C must be twin engine, and pilot IFR & night rated and current.

 

4) Standard night equipment required for both.

 

5) Flight Plans required.

 

Ok I think thats it, but I am sure I have missed some.

[Stealthray]

all the above are correct if you are a commericial operator,therefore most vfr operators are day vfr only. In the private or corporate world, no OC reqiured and you can carry passengers if the pilot has a night rating

[Sisyphus]

I have flown commercially at night in both Canada and the US. In the States commercial single pilot, single engine night is the norm.

In west Texas at night it can be very dark. Even if the ceiling is several thousand feet and the reported visibility several miles, if it is overcast there are times when there are no ground lights or horizon. The ground is not perceptable. If an autorotation is necessary it would be a crap shoot at the bottom.

On two or three occasions, unforecast early morning fog formed. No need to dwell on the horror of being caught at night in the fog. Fortunately we were on the ground those times. Once or twice unforecast dust storms caused problems. Unfortunately we were in the air at the time.

Given that the modern gas turbine is a highly reliable piece of equipment, having two engines is a great comfort.

If one is going to fly at night, one should be confident in one's IFR abilities. Real IFR is more than spending thirty minutes under a hood being able to catch glimpses of the ground through the chin bubble. Being IFR rated is no guarentee of being able to cope with inadvertant IFR, a fact to which many accident reports will attest.

[CTD]

Excellent points. From my own experiences, I have always thought that even the current regulations were not strong enough, and it's going to get even more lax as TC gets out of the business.

[3BX2]

good points Thumper, the only thing to "crusify" er "crucify", er "crussifie", er "nail you to the cross on" is your spelling.

[gannet]

I agree that flying at night can be essentially IFR even under VFR conditions. We always briefed moonrise, illumination by moon and illumination levels from built up areas. Black@ss nights make me nervous, a flight from Cartwright to Goose comes to mind and a search 30 miles off Halifax, but conversely, some of my best memories were flying on nights with great illumination. A shooting star while flying over the Bay de Chaleur that lit up the cockpit or nights with a full moon and clear skies. I guess I fall into the group of people that feel properly done, night flying can be done with not much more risk than day flying. The key is properly done. You can't just blast off and not know your safe altitudes, and terrain is always a prime concern as are illumination levels.

[Elvis]

This topic brings back a memory of coming back to town a night in a Bell 47 with a 100 hr pilot on His first job. With the customer sitting in the seat between Us He came up with the statement ' wow "this is the first time I ever flew at night ,is this ever fun.

 

Needless to say the customer was not impressed.

 

:elvis: :shock: :elvis: :shock: :elvis:

[Elvis]

This topic brings back a memory of coming back to town a night in a Bell 47 with a 100 hr pilot on His first job. With the customer sitting in the seat between Us He came up with the statement ' wow "this is the first time I ever flew at night ,is this ever fun.

 

Needless to say the customer was not impressed.

 

:elvis: :shock: :elvis: :shock: :elvis:

[Elvis]

Opps finger problems.