Vortex Ring State Versus Settling With Power.

[Over-Talk]

If you are thinking any of these.........stop thinking.

This is a time for immediate action, not thinking.

Push the cyclic forward.

[deuce bigalow]

If you are thinking any of these.........stop thinking.

This is a time for immediate action, not thinking.

Push the cyclic forward.

 

And now kiddies its time for a few scary stories from some of those grizzled and maybe even not so grizzled pilots that have come close to having the earth rise up and smite them as a result of.............................................................Vortex Ring State...............and lived to tell the tale.

 

(we'll do settling with power stories another time)

 

[Justin4]

 

 

Gross weight, alt, wind, etc, etc has nothing to do with it. I remember learning this the hard way with an empty 205 and a 150 ft line......"there I was, nothing on the clock but the makers name"

 

So your saying that gross weight and alt has nothing to do with it? I realize you can get into it at any gross weight and any alt but I do know that high gross weight and high alt will further onset SWP or VRS

[Justin4]

This is where I got my Info

scan0001.pdf

[Outwest]

So your saying that gross weight and alt has nothing to do with it? I realize you can get into it at any gross weight and any alt but I do know that high gross weight and high alt will further onset SWP or VRS

 

but I do know that high gross weight and high alt will further onset SWP or VRS

 

You need to go back on this post......VRS and SWP are apples and oranges, so your previous statement is partially incorrect.

 

For SWP of course GW and ALT and also temperature and wind will play a big part.

 

For VRS the 3 items I previously mentioned must be there......remove anyone of them and it will not happen. For example, being downwind may lead you into a situation where you might get into VRS, but it is not a cause.

 

As for getting out of it, you must remove at least one of the 3 items. Enter autorotation, VRS gone. Increase airspeed, VRS gone. Reduce ROD, VRS gone, of course the last one is impossible........

 

 

[Justin4]

Ok I see what you are saying. Sorry I misunderstood you.

[deuce bigalow]

This is where I got my Info

 

I think your quoted document might be of the American brand. As stated earlier in the thread they use the terms interchangeably in the US. In Canada (and the rest of the world) they are two different things.

 

they don't know how t spell colour or pronounce Lieutenant either.

 

But we still love them.

 

[cap]

Want to confirm the difference between "Settling with power" and "Vortex ring"? Try taking-off with that real heavy load that takes a long shallow climb to get going and then try to verical that same load down into some hole not too far away. 'Hot dog' the a/c when it is empty, internally loaded or externally loaded and do so into some place vertically without minding what your VSI is telling you and you'll soon find out the difference between the two. Try both of these on a Bell rotor system and then on a multi-blade rotor system of some type and learn the difference.........because there is.

 

THEN, when the day comes that you've learned all that and the moment comes that you are now operating a Bell 204/05 possibly, you'll maybe be unlucky enough to encounter something you heard about and thought maybe it was a myth of some type.........COLLECTIVE BOUNCE. You will experience this only ONCE (GUARANTEED - unless you are terminally stupid) and immediaately determine just what in the **** happened.....and when you do so, you'll make a pack with God that you never do it again.

 

So SLOW THE HECK DOWN, USE BRAIN or become familar with what 'The MacPherson Seatbelt' is.

[deuce bigalow]

Want to confirm the difference between "Settling with power" and "Vortex ring"? Try taking-off with that real heavy load that takes a long shallow climb to get going and then try to verical that same load down into some hole not too far away. 'Hot dog' the a/c when it is empty, internally loaded or externally loaded and do so into some place vertically without minding what your VSI is telling you and you'll soon find out the difference between the two. Try both of these on a Bell rotor system and then on a multi-blade rotor system of some type and learn the difference.........because there is.

 

THEN, when the day comes that you've learned all that and the moment comes that you are now operating a Bell 204/05 possibly, you'll maybe be unlucky enough to encounter something you heard about and thought maybe it was a myth of some type.........COLLECTIVE BOUNCE. You will experience this only ONCE (GUARANTEED - unless you are terminally stupid) and immediaately determine just what in the **** happened.....and when you do so, you'll make a pack with God that you never do it again.

 

So SLOW THE HECK DOWN, USE BRAIN or become familar with what 'The MacPherson Seatbelt' is.

 

Wisdom as usual from the wise old owl.

 

There is also the more frequent attention getter called pylon rock in the 204/05/12 mediums. Loads of fun with a load on the long line.

 

[ISE DA BY]

Wisdom as usual from the wise old owl.

 

There is also the more frequent attention getter called pylon rock in the 204/05/12 mediums. Loads of fun with a load on the long line.

 

Could someone explain pylon rock? My first job a few years ago was swamping on a 212 for the summer and I remember one time the pilot taking control saying I was starting to get the machine into pylon rock. I've heard the 212 drivers mention it from time to time, but never really heard it explained. I've also heard it mentioned it's possible to get in 206/206L?

 

Cheers