Vortex Ring State Versus Settling With Power.

[cap]

ISE DA BY -------another good one brought up by 'Deuce' that doesn't appear in any Manual out of Ft. Worth, TX.

 

Ever practised 'off-level' landings and take-off's in any kind of R/W? There are certain things you do at that time and certain things you don't do. 'Over-controlling' with that cyclic is one of them and you do everything s-l-o-w and s-m-o-o-t-h-e. That's your introduction to 'pylon rock'. So forget the 'jerky-jerky' on the cyclic and be S-M-O-O-T-H-E. Forget both of these in a '04/05/12 and you'll understand why they don't do anything fast and don't recover fast either.........so mentally be ahead of these a/c at ALL times That ripping sound of metal is something else that stays with you also..........if you survive your mistake.

 

You can also do all of the proper things that you are supposed to do and still encounter 'pylon rock' with some Mediums, but that is the result of a maintenance issue and the a/c is 'talking to you' and advising you of same......so 'listen' to it and pay attention. Have it looked at by maintenance after you've decided that it's not the 'loose nut between the collective and the cyclic' that is inducing same.

[splitpin]

ISE DA BY -------another good one brought up by 'Deuce' that doesn't appear in any Manual out of Ft. Worth, TX.

 

'Over-controlling' with that cyclic is one of them and you do everything s-l-o-w and s-m-o-o-t-h-e. That's your introduction to 'pylon rock'. So forget the 'jerky-jerky' on the cyclic and be S-M-O-O-T-H-E. Forget both of these in a '04/05/12 and you'll understand why they don't do anything fast and don't recover fast either.........so mentally be ahead of these a/c at ALL times That ripping sound of metal is something else that stays with you also..........if you survive your mistake.

 

More good advice from an "Old Fart" Ironic isn't it that a lot of younger folks want us to retire. Where would the "words of wisdom" come from then??

 

Regarding the S-M-O-O-T-H thing cap speaks of, an "Old Fart" in my younger days told me a good medium Pilot will always fly as if his knackers are between his hand and the cyclic stick. I have noticed over these many years that the exceptional medium Pilots all fly like that. And---they never rush!!!

 

[rotrhd1]

All a very good read and hopefull everyone has a clear understanding of the two critter's differences.

 

I'd like to add though, that having a descent rate is not always needed... although it is 99% of the time.

 

I was flying support for logging... waiting for the logging machine to get out of the way so I could deliver the last 2 bundles of chokers... I was holding them about 20 feet above the cut block watching the show... I looked inside and noticed the 206 was only using about 60% torque to hold them level... thinking to myself there must be a healthy vertical component to the wind by the mountain side, when the bottom fell out. Coiled up nearly half of the 200 feet of long line before I side stepped out of VRS.

 

The upflowing wind blew the vorticies back up through the rotor.

 

When I taught full time, I always breifed VFS somewhere around the circuit lessons and demonstrated VRS to students before they went solo. The R22 jumped right into it with noticable ques and results. Lots of fun. Demonstration of the recovery... lesson over.

 

RH1

[deuce bigalow]

Could someone explain pylon rock? My first job a few years ago was swamping on a 212 for the summer and I remember one time the pilot taking control saying I was starting to get the machine into pylon rock. I've heard the 212 drivers mention it from time to time, but never really heard it explained. I've also heard it mentioned it's possible to get in 206/206L?

 

Cheers

 

No aerodynamic explanation here. Just a simple one of what happens and how it feels.

 

Bell medium transmissions are connected to the fuselage in such a way that they are susceptible to sudden inputs in the cyclic. The classic mistake is to leave the force trim on with a load on a long line, put an input into the cyclic and then release the force trim so the cyclic jumps.

 

then the whole machine starts jumping. With a load on the line it can make the load start to jump in resonance to the transmission which will make the whole thing a lot worse.

 

Pretty scary. I worked with a guy that got it so bad his copilot punched off the load.

 

As CAP say's smooth movements are the order of the day when long lining in a Bell medium.

 

I learned the line on a HU500 which is utterly forgiving. You can crank the cyclic as much as you want to no effect.

 

Transition to the 212 was a steep learning curve.

[twinstar_ca]

www.baseops.net/ft_rucker/Q&A2.doc

 

interesting read....

[Justin4]

This may be the US vs. CAN again but is pylon rock the same as spike knock?

[cap]

Splitpin ----------I've did the 'lock n load', 'yard that collective up underneath your arm and 'bury that nose', just so you can hopefully get yourself, the a/c and your guys out of 'harm's way'. I've also experienced something called 'the Huey Tuck' because of that and that doesn't/didn't appear in any Bell-inspired Flight Manual either. So I'll take s-m-o-o-t-h and s-l-o-w everytime since then, thank-you very much. On more than one occasion both of those actions have allowed me the time and 'avenue' to escape one of my bonehead actions or decisions and escape without hurting the a/c in any way. Last time I checked also, they make a/c every day and the parts for them, but all my parts are 'On Back Order' (Although some of those parts are starting to wear-out now).

[splitpin]

Splitpin ----------I've did the 'lock n load', 'yard that collective up underneath your arm and 'bury that nose', just so you can hopefully get yourself, the a/c and your guys out of 'harm's way'. I've also experienced something called 'the Huey Tuck' because of that and that doesn't/didn't appear in any Bell-inspired Flight Manual either. So I'll take s-m-o-o-t-h and s-l-o-w everytime since then, thank-you very much. On more than one occasion both of those actions have allowed me the time and 'avenue' to escape one of my bonehead actions or decisions and escape without hurting the a/c in any way. Last time I checked also, they make a/c every day and the parts for them, but all my parts are 'On Back Order' (Although some of those parts are starting to wear-out now).

 

And I would be willing to bet, you ALWAYS, ALWAYS, ALWAYS leave at least one backdoor open!!

I've seen a LOT of Pilots shut that backdoor or not have a plan "B" and have regreted it!! :down: :down:

[deuce bigalow]

This may be the US vs. CAN again but is pylon rock the same as spike knock?

 

Spike knock??

 

Sounds like the treatment I get from my wife when I get a little frisky in the morning.

 

Otherwise........never hoid of it.

 

[Over-Talk]

Spike knock ?????? Is that when you land a 206 so hard that the transmission rocks enough for the spike to hit the edge of plate around it ????

 

If you land your 206 that hard, you will probably get into pylon rock, the Huey shuffle and maybe even collective bounce by the time you move up to flying mediums.

 

You can usually avoid all of the above by flying a little bit more slowly and smoothly.

Yes, it's pretty boring........but the mechanics and passengers will love you for it.