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Mhp Decision Soon ! What Are The Odds ?

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Decision is expected soon , is the Farnborogh show next week ?.

So who do we think the winner is H92 , no service record but its a Sikorsky or Cormorant/ merlin/eH101 in service with some difficulties but a little overweight for the job ( IMHO) and probably higher life cycle cost ( sikorsky had some outstanding DOC figures for the 92 ( still theoretical though ))

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actually the Indian Navy is looking for 16 Sea kings , I think the hours on the Cdn ones might be a bit too high but who knows.


I know that in civil terms the CDN sea kings would be regarded as just having been broken in terms of flight hours .

I am sure the pilots will be happy what ever is chosen.

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{Insert New Jersey accent} Yaa, Whatever. . . :rolleyes:


But after the last post you had better look up ‘Pedantic’ and ‘Arcane’ too. Could you not find anything relevant to post? Check your sources... Dean Beeby? Why dont you submit an ATI yourself?


If on the other hand you feel the need to save us from ourselves, I would be glad to introduce you to the Senior Aircraft Maintenance Authority (SAMA). I’m sure that we have much to learn from you about both Technical Airworthiness and Operational Airworthiness. You could make a bundle by proffering your sage wisdom upon our uneducated masses. It is clearly your opinion we don't know what we are doing.


In the mean time - mihi molestus ne sis! :boring:

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####, whatever you do, don't ever change!!!! This forum would fall to the ground like a dead bird (sh*t hawk or eagle, which ever you like!!) if you did!!! :D


In the meantime F.A. I believe I exchanged a few thoughts with you a few months back in the "military section" of this forum where I asked why it was that the commercial operators could keep the S61's in the air doing what is arguably as tough if not tougher work than what the military does with essentialy the same A/C. I don't recall getting a clear cut evaluation of both scenarios and so I have to admit that because of my ignorance in military operations, I have to lean on ####'s side (god forbid, if god actually existed!!!) and say that from our point of view, it seems that the military doesn't seem to draw as big a life expectancy from their helicopters compared to us civilians.

My opinion is certainly based on my knowledge of civilian ops and my lack of knowledge of all things military.

Please don't be offended by my and even, I dare say, ####'s (forgive him for he knows not what he's sayin! :D ) opinion and instead, enlighten us on why things are the way they are!!!!!!! :up:


just kidding Maggie! :D

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Not worth going over it again. If you didn't get it on the other forum, you either don't believe me or don't understand when the explanations are given.


We who fly them; on the other hand, know why they are now obsolescent. We cannot really discuss everything we do with them, but they are now worn out. I'll bet police cars wear out fast too.. funny that.


No matter, y'all can buy 'em when we are done with them and do whatever you wish with them. Best of luck.

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... why it was that the commercial operators could keep the S61's in the air doing what is arguably as tough if not tougher work than what the military does with essentialy the same A/C.  ...

IMHO, the commercial operator has engineers with many years of experience working on the aircraft as a whole. The military, for years, had specialists that worked of specific items. My neighbour is a retired colonel that was head of maintenance for years in Shearwater. He'll tell you a lot of reasons why the Sea King is in such bad shape. The maintainers are limited by a strict budget, overhauls are done by the lowest bidder (YHZ based) and they've been "replacing" the aircraft for years, so they don't want to upgrade them.


The way I look at it, The engineers that keep the 61 logging for 12 hours a day have more years turning wrenches on the S61N than the average Sea King technician has years since birth.


While visiting Shearwater this fall to tour and learn about the V22 and AB609, a group of privates working on a freshly painted Sea King were supervised by a corporal who looked like he wasn't more than 20 years old. Experience is a factor.


Now on the other hand, the old Sea King spends a lot of time shut down on a deck that could be rolling 45 degrees in the middle of the north Atlantic. Not good for her compared to a nice dry, warm hangar. She is experiencing less wear and tear in flight.


Looking at the cockpit of the Sea King, I have to take my hat off to those that drive her around over the water at 100 feet or less searching for submarines, we, in the 61N, have a much easier job as far as cockpit layout and navigation systems.


People like to crap on the Sea King. Well think about it, some navies are trying to purchase them. The US Presidential helicopter is a Sea King. Forty three years ago, the S61A was a cadillac in it's class and has proven a long life. We sould buy the best available now so it will last as long.


My opinion doesn't matter here because due to an injury, my military experience was cut very short. The Super Puma wouldn't be a great choice as it has very limited pitch, roll and heave limits (the gear is very close together). The EH101 is 10000 lbs too heavy and limits the ship's C of G and ability to maneuver (something important in battle I would presume). The S92 is a beautiful aircraft built on a lot learned from the Blackhawk's technology, but it is new and a lot of electronics to deal with in a salt water environment.


Theoretically, the best machine they could have is the Sea King with upgraded avionics, six bladed tail rotor and composite blades. Bringing the engines up to the

level they should be at would be a start, and have a MGB that could handle the horsepower. But that would only make sense.


The MHP contract will decided for political reasons the way that they ended up with the Griffons, Airbuses, etc. The cancellation of the EH101 was a political decision, not a smart business decision. You and I will pay our taxes for a while to fund the $500 million that was paid in cancellation fees.


And we voted them back in... Like we really had much choice.

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