Pilot Training

[R22Captain]

[2lips]

Geez!!! I didn't read the other thread before posting that !!

Seriously, could this be true or not ?? The complainant seems really unhappy about his experience there

 

Really, with good intentions, looking forward an update about em.

 

Just hope i was not opening a can of worm's !!

 

Thanks for the troll Shaun...was not my intention atall.

[Swissmatt]

yesss .. the yearly Icefield slagging season has opened .. let'r rip!

[R22Captain]

Geez!!! I didn't read the other thread before posting that !!

Seriously, could this be true or not ?? The complainant seems really unhappy about his experience there

 

Really, with good intentions, looking forward an update about em.

 

Just hope i was not opening a can of worm's !!

 

Thanks for the troll Shaun...was not my intention atall.

Sling commenting on icefield about 7 post's down

 

welcome back.....how long till you get banned this time?

[__________]

This is for anyone actually considering working for Icefield. As some of the rumours are true some are not and some just outdated..........

 

I have worked for Icefield for the past 4+ years. I had worked off and on with a couple of companies on the ground for 5 years and did not get lucky. I looked at working for icefield as an investment into my career. However my investment was not as large as others may have been. I still did not want to loose it, so I worked my a$$ off. There are many in the industry who finish there initial CPL then blow thousands of dollars on endorsements and advanced training that they will not use until they get experience. Meanwhile the schools are happy to take their money. However it still comes down to attitude, work ethic and common sense. Unfortunately just because you paid your initial training cost it doesn't entitle you to employment no matter who you work for. Currently there are around half a dozen pilots who have put in 4+ years with Icefield. Some pilots leave after a year or so due to better opportunities or don't agree with their progression rate and some get Fired. However it is no "walk in the Park". And if you don't go in ready to work hard with long days and long hours then you will never make it in this industry no matter where you get your start. The first year is rough, however the pay increases yearly. Although generally the more time you have the easier things get in this industry. Last season I had a couple of great jobs. Got up in the morning machine was ready to go then after landing engineer cleaned and put the machine to bed was long days with average flight hours, but was making over 7K a month. So my advice to any lowtimers seriously interested is do your research then actually go out there and meet the pilots work with them and listen to what they have to say. They will not bull $hit you and will tell you exactly how it is, and how tough it can be. No one there wants to put all the effort into a new employee's training if they arn't going to stick around. And if you have any doubts don't do it. In the 4+ years I have been with Icefield I have seen a lot of lowtime pilots come and go. Many who I am still friends with today. Although some move onto better things and some regret leaving, as many companies in this industry are very similar in thier ways. And as the saying goes "the Grass isn't always greener".

 

Here's to the Ignorant chief pilot's out there:

 

A friend applied for a low time position in a North East Alberta oil town, and was basically told that his hours at icefield were worthless. Well even at my low level of experience I know that a guy with under 500hrs you can't expect too much out of. However flying around the mountains usually at around + 6000 DA in winds up to 35 Mph GS is great experience for a lowtimer if managed properly through a mentoring program.I would put an icefield lowtime pilot up against any other pilots with the same hours. And it's easy to say that dropping off surveyor's in Swamps all day long isn't really that difficult either. Well i can say that i have found it more difficult slinging pigs to the top of a 7000' cliff or dropping a heavy load of pax at 8500' than dropping surveyors and quads in swamps. But then again every job is different and has it's own risks. The only 1 thing that some of the lowertime pilots may lack is operational experience which i have seen many pilots progress into positions in other companies with ease. on the flip side I am sure there are also a lot of Chief pilots that are satisfied with the skills and attitudes of there ex-icefield employees.

 

Good luck to the lowtime guys trying to find work this summer.

[chopperman]

This is for anyone actually considering working for Icefield. As some of the rumours are true some are not and some just outdated..........

 

I have worked for Icefield for the past 4+ years. I had worked off and on with a couple of companies on the ground for 5 years and did not get lucky. I looked at working for icefield as an investment into my career. However my investment was not as large as others may have been. I still did not want to loose it, so I worked my a$$ off. There are many in the industry who finish there initial CPL then blow thousands of dollars on endorsements and advanced training that they will not use until they get experience. Meanwhile the schools are happy to take their money. However it still comes down to attitude, work ethic and common sense. Unfortunately just because you paid your initial training cost it doesn't entitle you to employment no matter who you work for. Currently there are around half a dozen pilots who have put in 4+ years with Icefield. Some pilots leave after a year or so due to better opportunities or don't agree with their progression rate and some get Fired. However it is no "walk in the Park". And if you don't go in ready to work hard with long days and long hours then you will never make it in this industry no matter where you get your start. The first year is rough, however the pay increases yearly. Although generally the more time you have the easier things get in this industry. Last season I had a couple of great jobs. Got up in the morning machine was ready to go then after landing engineer cleaned and put the machine to bed was long days with average flight hours, but was making over 7K a month. So my advice to any lowtimers seriously interested is do your research then actually go out there and meet the pilots work with them and listen to what they have to say. They will not bull $hit you and will tell you exactly how it is, and how tough it can be. No one there wants to put all the effort into a new employee's training if they arn't going to stick around. And if you have any doubts don't do it. In the 4+ years I have been with Icefield I have seen a lot of lowtime pilots come and go. Many who I am still friends with today. Although some move onto better things and some regret leaving, as many companies in this industry are very similar in thier ways. And as the saying goes "the Grass isn't always greener".

 

Here's to the Ignorant chief pilot's out there:

 

A friend applied for a low time position in a North East Alberta oil town, and was basically told that his hours at icefield were worthless. Well even at my low level of experience I know that a guy with under 500hrs you can't expect too much out of. However flying around the mountains usually at around + 6000 DA in winds up to 35 Mph GS is great experience for a lowtimer if managed properly through a mentoring program.I would put an icefield lowtime pilot up against any other pilots with the same hours. And it's easy to say that dropping off surveyor's in Swamps all day long isn't really that difficult either. Well i can say that i have found it more difficult slinging pigs to the top of a 7000' cliff or dropping a heavy load of pax at 8500' than dropping surveyors and quads in swamps. But then again every job is different and has it's own risks. The only 1 thing that some of the lowertime pilots may lack is operational experience which i have seen many pilots progress into positions in other companies with ease. on the flip side I am sure there are also a lot of Chief pilots that are satisfied with the skills and attitudes of there ex-icefield employees.

 

Good luck to the lowtime guys trying to find work this summer.

Well said, I have posted on this topic before and I will ask again for those of you that are so against Icefield and their ways "what do you or your company do to get low time/entry level pilots their start in the industry?" So what if they pay for training and a PPC, it's their choice and it gives them a job! They can earn back some of their investment while building the almighty flight hours. I see nothing wrong with their system if thats what people choose, at least they are getting pilots started out.

Some of you posters are always negative when it comes to giving advice as to whether a person should get a licence or where to work or not work. How about some positive feedback? I'm not saying to be unrealistic, let them know it's tough to get that first job and that the pay is crap and the hours are long.....so what what job isn't????? My experience as a person that hired low time pilots for almost 10 years is that the ones that really want it will get jobs.

For those of you thinking of getting your licence if it's what you want go for it, it won't be easy but its worth it.

[Daz]

This is for anyone actually considering working for Icefield. As some of the rumours are true some are not and some just outdated..........

 

I have worked for Icefield for the past 4+ years. I had worked off and on with a couple of companies on the ground for 5 years and did not get lucky. I looked at working for icefield as an investment into my career. However my investment was not as large as others may have been. I still did not want to loose it, so I worked my a$$ off. There are many in the industry who finish there initial CPL then blow thousands of dollars on endorsements and advanced training that they will not use until they get experience. Meanwhile the schools are happy to take their money. However it still comes down to attitude, work ethic and common sense. Unfortunately just because you paid your initial training cost it doesn't entitle you to employment no matter who you work for. Currently there are around half a dozen pilots who have put in 4+ years with Icefield. Some pilots leave after a year or so due to better opportunities or don't agree with their progression rate and some get Fired. However it is no "walk in the Park". And if you don't go in ready to work hard with long days and long hours then you will never make it in this industry no matter where you get your start. The first year is rough, however the pay increases yearly. Although generally the more time you have the easier things get in this industry. Last season I had a couple of great jobs. Got up in the morning machine was ready to go then after landing engineer cleaned and put the machine to bed was long days with average flight hours, but was making over 7K a month. So my advice to any lowtimers seriously interested is do your research then actually go out there and meet the pilots work with them and listen to what they have to say. They will not bull $hit you and will tell you exactly how it is, and how tough it can be. No one there wants to put all the effort into a new employee's training if they arn't going to stick around. And if you have any doubts don't do it. In the 4+ years I have been with Icefield I have seen a lot of lowtime pilots come and go. Many who I am still friends with today. Although some move onto better things and some regret leaving, as many companies in this industry are very similar in thier ways. And as the saying goes "the Grass isn't always greener".

 

Here's to the Ignorant chief pilot's out there:

 

A friend applied for a low time position in a North East Alberta oil town, and was basically told that his hours at icefield were worthless. Well even at my low level of experience I know that a guy with under 500hrs you can't expect too much out of. However flying around the mountains usually at around + 6000 DA in winds up to 35 Mph GS is great experience for a lowtimer if managed properly through a mentoring program.I would put an icefield lowtime pilot up against any other pilots with the same hours. And it's easy to say that dropping off surveyor's in Swamps all day long isn't really that difficult either. Well i can say that i have found it more difficult slinging pigs to the top of a 7000' cliff or dropping a heavy load of pax at 8500' than dropping surveyors and quads in swamps. But then again every job is different and has it's own risks. The only 1 thing that some of the lowertime pilots may lack is operational experience which i have seen many pilots progress into positions in other companies with ease. on the flip side I am sure there are also a lot of Chief pilots that are satisfied with the skills and attitudes of there ex-icefield employees.

 

Good luck to the lowtime guys trying to find work this summer.

 

Thanks for this. There's lots of rumours and hearsay out there, so it's nice to actually hear from someone with first hand experience.

I contacted them a couple years ago right after I finished school - I was sent a letter that laid everything out in great detail; wages, living arrangements, costs, etc. Between that letter, past threads here, and your experience above, there should be no surprises for anyone. If I went to work there and found it to be a bad experience, then the only person to blame would be me, not them. Sure, they might do things outside the industry norm, but it's ultimately still my choice to accept that.

 

I would like to hear more about your experience with Icefield's mentoring and staff training. Did/do you find it excellent/adequate/lacking? How might it compare to paying for training at a school? How might it compare to recurrent training that an operational company might give their pilots?

 

It's a bit worrying that some chief pilots consider Icefields time "worthless", and *that* would be one of the biggest deterrents to me - knowing that I'd made an investment that might turn out to be detrimental to my career.

 

Disclaimer: I have no affiliation with them or anyone. I haven't applied there for this season. I'm not trying to start a slagfest; just keen to keep civil discussion going.

[Helilog56]

It's a bit worrying that some chief pilots consider Icefields time "worthless", and *that* would be one of the biggest deterrents to me - knowing that I'd made an investment that might turn out to be detrimental to my career.

 

For a C.P. too speak out like that actually tells me a couple of things.......a person that should "not" be in his/her position, a person I would "not", want representing my company and its pilots.......in other words the only real "worthless" thing here....... is that C.P.

[shakey]

Thanks for this. There's lots of rumours and hearsay out there, so it's nice to actually hear from someone with first hand experience.

I contacted them a couple years ago right after I finished school - I was sent a letter that laid everything out in great detail; wages, living arrangements, costs, etc. Between that letter, past threads here, and your experience above, there should be no surprises for anyone. If I went to work there and found it to be a bad experience, then the only person to blame would be me, not them. Sure, they might do things outside the industry norm, but it's ultimately still my choice to accept that.

 

I would like to hear more about your experience with Icefield's mentoring and staff training. Did/do you find it excellent/adequate/lacking? How might it compare to paying for training at a school? How might it compare to recurrent training that an operational company might give their pilots?

 

It's a bit worrying that some chief pilots consider Icefields time "worthless", and *that* would be one of the biggest deterrents to me - knowing that I'd made an investment that might turn out to be detrimental to my career.

 

Disclaimer: I have no affiliation with them or anyone. I haven't applied there for this season. I'm not trying to start a slagfest; just keen to keep civil discussion going.

[Cole]

To quote a very high time pilot I happen to be sitting beside as I type-

 

"It's up to the PIC to make their time 'worth' anything. Some people can fly the same camp in Northern Alberta for years and not learn a single thing past the first week, and others can fly 100 hours of tours in the rockies and learn something every single flight. To say one type of experience or the other is worthless is totally ignorant."

 

As far as I'm concerned some of my friends, including pilots now rated on vertols, mediums, and full time seismic astar pilots, have spent 7 or 8 years getting flying the traditional way for very low wages chasing carrots that may never have amounted to anything, often jumping company to company looking for a start.

One fact exists about icefield, if you pay your dues there, both financially and otherwise, it seems very clear flying is imminent. That's most definitely not true of all companies.

 

Cheers,

Happy Flying in 2011

Cole