Vih Buys And Ec130b4

[RDM]

fill yer boots with the longline mirror system, it can be done, but I bet it's mostly used 'cause the guys can't do VR

 

 

I second that one 407.....have seen lots of dudes use mirrors, it can be done but bloody slow, and do not let anything go ascew at the wrong moment, let alone half your site picture is missing.Nope, i will stick with my bad back and stiff neck.

[407 Driver]

I actually find it quite comfortable out the window...even the pac-man window of a 350 isn't at all bad. Did many 9 hour days in the 350 and 407 on the top end of a 150.

[Peeshooter]

407

 

Maybe I went a little hard on the C47, but every engineer I have ever spoken to says the TM engines are just better built, and this is probably reflected in the price. As for the electric mirror system that can be put on just about any helicopter for 20-30K, makes long line work easy and one does not have to have a neck cramp. The whole VR thing is easy with such a miror system and especially precision work. I have 400 hrs or so on the mirrors when I was in the alps back in the early 90's. Why it never caught on here I will never know , but I imagine that it's probably got something to do with the belief that things just have to be difficult.

 

Just my opinion

 

PS. The 407 is a great machine too but at altitude I do not know how it will fair agianst the EC130 B4.

[407 Driver]

You are certainly entitled to your opinion here, and we all welcome it.

 

As many others have noticed, I DO strongly defend the 407 (and Bell).

 

There's a few personal reasons for my anti Turbomeca attitude, but we won't go there now

 

I don't agree with your opinion on VR being an issue though.

 

As I mentioned earlier, hanging out the window all day, even in a 350 is no issue to most experienced guys, but to each his own.

 

When you flew the mirror in the past, what was the typical line length, and the typical job? Dangling a 150 or 180 deep into the trees in the interior wet-belt will be a challenge, with the poor vis and poor lighting ?

 

I have no idea how the 130B4 will do, plus I don't recall ever bad mouthing it's performance, with only 3 registered in Canada, it will be a while until we get real data back from the field on it's performance and usefulness.

[Peeshooter]

407

 

In regard to your first question, unfortunately I have no time with the C47 but have a about 2000 on a C20,C28,C30, and about 1000 hrs on the A350. Who knows?, maybe some time with the 407 and I could be convinced that Bell has a helciopter that can be filled up with fuel,and with power to spare. What's the ride like in autos?

 

As far as the long lining thing goes, I will tell you first hand that the electric, heated mirror system that is widely used in Europe is fantastic for production work. I personally have never used it with more than a 100'er. I am very surprised that it never caught on for seismic work and I am sure that it would have a great effect on productivity, as the fatigue the pilot has to endure could be greatly reduced. Long lining just becomes so untedious. Both mirrors are heated, and the larger load mirror is wired to the chinaman to enable pitch control. It's great!!!

 

I agree with you wholly that there are circumstances when rubber necking is absolutely required to assure aim, in a tough spot and a long,long line. In 97' I moved a 400' load 12 miles off shore , I think in this case the mirrors would have been impossible as the load had to be split positioned differently at different lengths.

 

I like the bell machines, and I feel super safe in the 206 , the flight stability characteristics of bell machines are great, feels like you a flying a barge in comparison to the 350.

 

Well, at least they didn't install a NOTAR on the 130. The fenstrom seems to be good for better stability in high cross wind situation? But, I could be wrong. Love to have a go at a 130!

 

 

Cheers

 

PS

[407 Driver]

Yes Peashooter, please explain the Mirror system to us, perhaps in another thread. It would be interesting to learn more about it.

 

Got Pictures?

 

Oh, for the record, I have about 12,000 hrs on C- series (single) engines, C-18 to C-47. Never an inflight issue !

[Peeshooter]

Wish I could provide more info but have not seen such system here in Canada or for sale. Elisystem Agricola based in Bolzano was where I saw and used the gear. I haven't spoken with Comandante Tonini in a decade. The swiss probably also have this gear. Checking with some of the mountain EU companies would be the place to start.

 

Wow 407! that's alot of C series time. When did you start flying?

 

 

Cheers

 

 

PS

[100ft]

Back when Christ.....well he had a different job back then.

[T-rex]

I looked into the 'electric mirror' system. It has a 'place' but a pilot will never be able to do any production work with it! Nothing beats the 'toilet bowl!'

[sharkbait]

Not to start an arguement but I saw a Heli-union guy using one doing siesmic in Africa and he seemed to be doing just fine with it - no complaints from the customer who was used to guys doing it out the windows.

Like anything else - maybe it just takes some time to get good and fast.

Happy New Year to all.