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Resetting Cb's & Hac


Pally
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One thing for sure is that circuit breakers are not meant to be used as switches. The Canadian way is to use the boost pump cicuit breakers to turn the pumps on and off. This is wrong. The 206 flight manual says nothing about using the c.b.'s in such a fashion. The FM also requires that the fuel valve switch be turned off, which Canadian pilots never do.

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Sisphus------1) you've just indicated how long you have been around a Bell 206 and 2) your fuel drains must be interesting in the morning.

 

Why do I smell lawyers and the word "liability" with all this when I also hear the words "Swissair disaster" in the same presentation? I will assume that by "c/b" they also mean a "toggle switch"? I trust not because many typical c/b's have toggle swtches in their place and if I can't turn then "ON" and "Off"....I got some problems on the flight deck.

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As cap has mentioned there are a lot of toggle switch cb's in a lot of a/c...in the L's for one...if Us canadians were leaving the fuel valve on and the breakers in... there would be a lot of dead batteries in the morning...as well the 407 comes with toggle breakers for the boost pumps from the factory.... coinsident...I think they finally saw the light :rolleyes:

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Sisyphus:

What Cap said!

Well if the !@#$%^&*( CB popped it popped for a reason did it not.

If it ain't desperately needed why reset it.

If it's minus 40 and I ain't parked in front of the hangar I don't even want to shut off the darn engine and, if forced to, trust me, the fuel valve stays on! Thank You very much!

Bye the bye a fuel valve on or off is not going to affect a hot shutdown - there is more than enough fuel between valve and fuel control to toast the turbine to a pretty blue colour and your face to a brilliant red.

If installed, inverters will be off immediately, fuel pumps @ 10% N1 and the Battery ASAP to conserve every possible Amp in that Battery for the next start.

If you ever flew with the old type rad alt and didn't pull the CB ( No switch provided on Bell products) keep lots and lots of spares on hand - you'll need them.

By the way when you say Canadian do you mean all of us or just the much maligned Canadian Helicopters who it seems are responsible for all that is wrong with our business? Do you work for them? If so have you advised your Safety Officer, Maint, Ops and CP's Office of your concern. If so what was the reply?

If not why bring their procedures up here. What are YOUR procedures that YOU use? When parked at base? On top of a Mountain? In summer? In winter? What is the reasoning behind your actions? I am much more interested in that than other than what you have heard that other folks are doing, in your opinion, wrong.

CHC Global ops manual 1.5.6.1 covers the resetting of CBs in flight and advises that it is more prudent to not reset.

CHC Global no longer uses CB's as switches. ( the new radalts don't seem to mind voltage and amperage fluctuations during start )

Perhaps a Radio tech on the forum would be kind enough as to write a short note discussing the pros and cons.

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Pally: The most important point that I get from the HAC letter is that the policy letter is not enforceable because it is not legal. This is a big issue and I hope for all concern HAC is correct in their review. This type of information distribution is becoming the norm for the helicopter industry in Canada. (For Shark bait’s concern: NOT MEANING OR REFERING TO CANADIAN HELICOPTER CORP) Think about this for a moment:

1) The CARS were implemented (At a large cost) largely to make the Canadian air regulations into plain language. That could to be understood by the general public.

 

2) The CARS are law. That we as the general public understand.

 

If this is the case then way do we have Standards (They are not law as they have not passed the law making process)? Could it be to explain the plain language CAR? Better yet what is the purpose of a policy letter? To explain to the TC employees what the policy makers determined /understood when they read the plain language CAR! Way does Transport Canada want Companies to write policy manuals for procedure to meet CARS? This is policy letter is #161, have most of us ever read the other 160 that must have been written? How do they affect us? If as a rule they’re not distrubed to the industry. This is because they are meant for TC staff. Which brings up the other TC information source called Staff instruction’s which also are used to clarify those plain langish CARS to TC staff! I think we as a industry governed by TC might have a information distribution service difficulty problem that needs to be reported!

 

More food for thought: On the thought of changing the 206 fuel boost pump circuit breakers installed as part of the type design to circuit breaker switches. I refer to a policy letter on minor or major mods I was told exsistes. How many of us on this forum know of this policy letter or has read it? Where do we find policy letters of Staff instructions? I have been instructed to remove the AN3 bolts used in lue of the MS screws to hold the 206 tail boom access panel on under the policy letter of minor of major mod. I did remove them because we were told it was the law by a TC inspector. Would this same letter not apply to the fuel pump C/B verses C/B switches?

Also there was a thread on flight time versus air time that went off on a total different angle to the orig question. I believe there is a policy letter on air time vs. flight time with the understanding that once a helicopters blades are in motion it is air time, This is not what industry has been doing or is doing, If the policy letter only clarifies a existing regulation does this mean most of us have been recording our air time wrong? What about all the existing aircrafts retirement times are they in error? All based on the under standing of the difference of the term air time vs. flight time? What’s being done?

I hope for all concerned HAC gets the understanding of what we as a industry have to abide by.

 

WOW my finger hurts :blink:

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