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Resetting Cb's & Hac


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Peeshooter -----you've been watching too many "World Vision" commercials. There all kinds of government leaders in the Third World that wear $1000 tailored suits and have been Harvard and Oxford educated. They and their surrounding minions are not stupid and can afford the best in a/c inspections. The worst enemies the people of their countries have are THEM.


It makes no difference what Dupont says....you know it, so would you buy an a/c with that wiring onboard then? If you would, then whose falt is that? If some foreign country buys an a/c in Canada they will hire appropriately-trained people to inspect it with the same information you quoted. They make reccomendations and the governments buy it or they don't. That's called "due dilegence" and together with the appropriate paperwork and legal documents consimates the deal.....with seller guarantees maybe.


I don't go to ICAO meetings and I don't talk/know the Secretary-General of anything. I doubt if he could fly my a/c, knows the areas that I fly or could help my engineer do anything at 3AM in the morning. He can tell us both how to do our jobs though.


Don't lay the "guilt-trip" on me about Africa or the Third World contries. Check on who Sukarno of Indonesia embezzled to get his horde of $35B...ya $35B.. for himself and his family. He's gone, but Indonesia is one of the most corrupt countries in the world, so "hang on to your britches" as to where countless millions disappeared to during this relief effort in Indonesia. They are cautioning already that there is no "accounting" in place to know where all the monies are going. Don't blame that event on Johnny Canuck or "Uncle Sam" if/and when it happens......look east, look east.

Also for the record, Canada has pledged $400M+ for that disaster relief and you know how much the oil rich Kingdom of Saudi Arabia has pledged....$30M...and they take-in a reported $250M/day from oil. Thes same "stupid" people will buy a/c from us and blame us 1st World countries for shafting them. Gimme a break.

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not to mention that the saudis stated that their money was to help muslims ONLY!


what kind of a s#@tstorm would develop if canada or the US said that aid money was to help christians or buddhists only.............


sad thing is most of that pledged money will in fact go into the pockets of corrupt officials. sad but true :down:


as far as: "Who cares anyway, african life is worth less - Right? ( probably not worth hiring either)" goes, well all i can say is go over there for a couple of tours and then maybe you won't phrase it in the form of a question........... :shock:


north americans are so naive as to how the rest

of the world really functions...........



oh...ya....if the CB is popped, leave it out until your engineer can look at it :up:

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I don't think HAC is against circuit breaker policies but more about the fact that it is being forced upon us as a knee jerk reaction.If circuit Breakers were such a huge problem why are Aircraft Flight Manual and the Maintenance manual not being used for this issue.Why are companies being forced to write policy that superceeds your aircraft manuals.I guess transport is smarter than all the engeneers and experts that aircraft companies employ are for not.Just hire someone from transport who assumes no liability or responsibility and runwith it.

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Cap, 412


Well, this matter of the Kapton Wiring issue is something that I have had first hand experience with, and for the most part most of the older DC10's and 727's are all sold off to the 3 rd world countries especially when they come to the point that the FAA says the wiring must be replaced, so they get sold off to countries where the regulations may not come into full compliance with ICAO safety oversight audit recommendations and/or the SARPS.


You should also know that despite the fact that ICAO is supposed to be a great transparent international body where all are treated equally you should no that this is not the case and the US government controls many of the mechanisms to prevent countries for getting full compliance.

Yet the US professes that the process is transparent and mechanisms are equally assessable to all. It basically a crock and the Arabs know this.


I can assure you, as would many of my former colleagues at ICAO TCB that this is the case. In 1999 before the 911 matter I met with Mr. Amed the representative to Saudi Arabia who was seeking CAT 1 status for Saudi, The Jordanians where as well . They simply couldn't or where "not permitted to the equal access to Wb funds, so the French in defiance of the US did the job and despite that fact that they met with The TCB recommendations they where still kept out of the CAT 1 Club.


This is the case in many jurisdictions. It's all politics. The only country that never seemed to care where the Russians who where quite happy to be part of the convention but really didn't give a tinkers dam what the US asked for or any desire to be part of the CAT 1 Club, I imagine things are different today. It's been a few years since I have spoke to Vladimir from TCB.

It is and will be a continued practice that the old, obsolete, technology gets sent to the third world. The Kapton matter and the testing evidence is conclusive,and I'll tell you Dupont did a fine job of trying to suppress the file for fear of problems. I'll look it up for you like I may have a copy of the file in an old storage box somewhere. Even MCDLS. was pissed when the french did the testing.


When your country is CAT 1 it sure makes it allot easier when your asking or negotiating for overfligh rights with the US or Canadian Chief Air Negotiator.


Anyway enough said on the subject, I don't want CSIS knocking at my door. As for the $1000 dollar suits, it's more like $2500. $ 500 shoes not included.


OK, back to being a helicopter pilot it's less complicated. I got a real kick out of guy I spoke with today who was looking for a chief pilot, he actually though writing and amending a company 702.703 Ops manual required brains....HAHAHAHA , sure maybe grade 10.




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I thought you may find this interesting;


Kapton Wiring: The Silent Menace


By Lt. Jim Schmitt


Perhaps the desert sand of the Middle East has awakened the stray electrons that occasionally cause electrical glitches and failures on our four, permanent-detachment, MH-53E helicopters. But electrical gripes have become more regular, and they're the types that puzzle even the most experienced AE. I read the stories in Mech about the E-2's problems [April-June 2001, "The Resurgence of an Old Enemy" and Fall 2001, "Almost Bitten on a BITS Flight"-Ed.], and I want to share a few problems I've noticed with the H-53.


Every few days, the caution lights for the fuel-filter bypass intermittently would flash on one of our helos. After troubleshooting the engine, the AEs finally found the light came on only at night. Even more bizarre, they would go out when the switch for the caution-panel lighting was moved from the dim position (normal) to bright. The culprit finally was found; it was bad Kapton wiring behind the caution panel.


Another aircraft had a flickering master-caution light with no other associated caution lights. It would flicker only a couple times during each flight and nearly was impossible to troubleshoot. When tracing the wires, electricians finally found cracked Kapton wiring.


In the past year, our Bahrain detachment has completed 120 maintenance actions and spent more than 400 hours on problems with faulty Kapton wiring. These MAFs were not specific to a single system, but many of the gripes involved mission-critical systems.


Our det has been fortunate to fly hundreds of mishap-free operational missions since it formed more than two years ago. Most of the broken wires were discovered during daily, turnaround, preflight, and phase inspections. The timely recording of gripes led to the repair of faulty wiring before it could cause a major failure. But every flight is the roll of two dice: One to determine which aircraft will have the next failure, and the other to decide which wire will fail. Despite our maintainers' successes in dealing with Kapton wiring, in time, the failures will increase and, unfortunately, could lead to a catastrophic failure or a mishap. 


The most difficult part about flying an aircraft prone to faulty Kapton wiring is the unpredictability of the electrical system. No one knows how a faulty wire will affect any aircraft's electrical system. Because wires crack one at a time, a helo typically will not lose an entire system or component, just parts of it. The wires still carrying current will cause the component to act erratically. Even worse, the failures are intermittent because the crack in the wire opens and closes when an aircraft vibrates and maneuvers. This makes it nearly impossible to troubleshoot and leads to many gripes being signed off as "could not duplicate."


Cracked wires (as opposed to a clean break) are susceptible to arcing and can cause a fire. An in-flight fire especially is bad when flying blue-water ops, which is what the det does most of the time.


Aviation safety and mishap prevention relies on the removal of uncertainty. That is why pilots use checklists and maintainers follow MIMs. Trying to stay safe when dealing with uncertainty requires a lot of skill and a bit of luck. Based on the problems I've seen with Kapton wiring, we have been more lucky than good, and I'm worried our luck eventually will run out.

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Yes 412 many, but when you are big and powefull like dupont, It will never be the problem of your product, just imagine the ramifications. It's probably the guy that installed it or better yet the operator who wasn't doing his maintenance.


Read between the lines, I am certainly not the first to point to the Kapton menace. Do you believe that africans are the only ones who take payoffs, bribery.


Politics and payoffs. When Swiss air 111 went down they knew it was the wiring, every body I was working with at the time knew that the wiring probem would be avoided. Don't tell me trhat you believe that TSB allways tells the truth.


It's like the same double standard and hush hush over the backstabbing that goes on in our little industy. OH NO That doesn't happen. It's always or never, remember! Nobody will stick thier neck out. This is one of the reasons that the outspoken are piriah.


You where talking about the niavity or north americans to the ways of the world, well bribery and cooruption is global! Those with the gold make the rules.





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