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donnybrook

Hac Letter Concerning Foreign Workers

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At what point did I mention low timers? You know what they say about making assumtions! I think the point is lost on people like yourself. Great country we live and my point is if you don't agree with Mr. Jones's letter you have the right to give your say in a rebuttle letter. Its your right as a Canadian. 3 and 3 is a great tour! Would your wife put up with a 42 and 5 the 5 being wx days? I think not.

 

All the Best.

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Hi Brent,

Here is my opinion- I have nothing against experienced pilots coming temporarily and welcome you to come fly in our amazing country. However, I have seen foreign workers filling the 500-1000hr positions because they are willing to work for pennies. These are the positions we have to keep Canadians in otherwise there is no room for our local pilots to get the experience they need. But how does the government or industry draw the line on an experience level for foreign admission? It's a tough one.

 

Flingwinger

 

I agree totally with what you say. Every industry needs to bring on junior people and if that does not happen in your own country where you have just spent all your money to get your licence you can get some sort of attitude but you just have to try to prove to a potential employer that you are a better option. Then there is the travelling visa agreements for under 31s that do not take industry issues and it is just a blanket for backpackers etc to travel the world and pilots fall into this and they all head off from around the world to where there is a lot of helicopters. We have a bigger problem down here of low timer pilots wanting to work for nothing and when I get pilots offering this I tell them to bugger off as I look at it as these pilots do not value their own time so they are not worth any thing to my business, I always pay new pilots above the award. The problem goes both ways as if new pilots were not willing to work for nothing, companies would have to pay what the job position is worth, but if a newbie is getting training and the company is in some way absorbing some of the cost dues to unproductively and is treating the pilot well then a bit of loyalty from the newbie should be expected and to hang around for a few years if the work is there. I think some companies now have been stung a few times so work on pay them poor and then expect them to bugger off. More of a two fold problem so there needs to be some way to go on both sides, Makes it hard for a person who may be married trying to get a break in the industry, and then there are companies that just treat people bad and pay just the same so pilots transit there to get hours and move on and that is well know and the pilots now they well be treated bad but look at the hours, This goes on all around the world.

As for me as stated at some time when I have sold my helicopter business I would like to come on a working holiday and defiantly do not want to stand on toes but then bring my children over at the end of work and invest all my earnings back into your economy .

The one thing I have found in the time I have spent over in Canada the pilots I have come into contact with have all been great and the one thing about us is we all have something in common and most seem willing to go that bit extra for another pilot which just makes things are more enjoyable and at the time you never know whether the pilot is on a good wicket or just there to move on at the next best opportunity due to not being treated right or not paid well.

 

All the best with trying to solve this forever running issue.

 

Brent

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www.tntaheli.com/employment.htm

 

This ad has been on our Company website for at least 2 years and been advertised continuously in both the "Vertical" and "Helicopters" magazines as well. Both of those magazines are considered to be the best avenue in Canada for reaching the target employment pool, yet we have some difficulty in filling these positions. If there are any qualified pilots out there with the desired personal skills (ie: are flexible and adaptable, are great with customers, possesses good communication and team work skills, has a strong work ethic, is professional and faces the day with a positive attitude...) AND are interested in relocating to the Yukon, working fulltime and has the aptitude and desire to run a base; now would be a good time to get in touch and send a resume.

 

We would like nothing more than to be able to hire a Canadian person to fill these positions and not be burdened with the excessive heaps of paperwork which comes with having to hire foreign workers through this, or any other, program. With wages and flight pay being the same (as per company pay structure), there is certainly no financial advantage to us having to go outside of our country to find employees, as some here have suggested, and being forced to do that is a pain in the butt we certainly don't need.

 

It is a different lifestyle up here and certainly not suited for everyone. However, if you are a helicopter pilot who loves the outdoors, the mountains and everything that goes along with them, wants variety in your work in a challenging environment and wants to live in the north, there is no better place to be. Keep in mind, with only 35,000 people in the whole territory (25,000 of them in the city of Whitehorse alone) the Yukon is remote, with a lot of real estate between towns and the only Starbucks, McDonalds and Walmart that can be found, is in the capital city of Whitehorse.

 

We look forward to hearing from potential candidates,

 

Clint Walker

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www.tntaheli.com/employment.htm

 

This ad has been on our Company website for at least 2 years and been advertised continuously in both the "Vertical" and "Helicopters" magazines as well. Both of those magazines are considered to be the best avenue in Canada for reaching the target employment pool, yet we have some difficulty in filling these positions. If there are any qualified pilots out there with the desired personal skills (ie: are flexible and adaptable, are great with customers, possesses good communication and team work skills, has a strong work ethic, is professional and faces the day with a positive attitude...) AND are interested in relocating to the Yukon, working fulltime and has the aptitude and desire to run a base; now would be a good time to get in touch and send a resume.

 

We would like nothing more than to be able to hire a Canadian person to fill these positions and not be burdened with the excessive heaps of paperwork which comes with having to hire foreign workers through this, or any other, program. With wages and flight pay being the same (as per company pay structure), there is certainly no financial advantage to us having to go outside of our country to find employees, as some here have suggested, and being forced to do that is a pain in the butt we certainly don't need.

 

It is a different lifestyle up here and certainly not suited for everyone. However, if you are a helicopter pilot who loves the outdoors, the mountains and everything that goes along with them, wants variety in your work in a challenging environment and wants to live in the north, there is no better place to be. Keep in mind, with only 35,000 people in the whole territory (25,000 of them in the city of Whitehorse alone) the Yukon is remote, with a lot of real estate between towns and the only Starbucks, McDonalds and Walmart that can be found, is in the capital city of Whitehorse.

 

We look forward to hearing from potential candidates,

 

Clint Walker

 

Perhaps you should also post your ads to the Employment forum here.

 

Personally, when I'm looking for work, I don't spend much time looking at print ads in the magazines. They're more often than not out of date, or fishing to fill candidate pools for the long term. I usually look here, then on aeroads, and then on the "other" Canadian helicopter magazine's job board. These are the places most interesting and worthwhile jobs for helicopter pilots in Canada are posted (imho) and they're free for both employers and job seekers. Actually, I got my present job directly through these forums... :)

 

I also rarely look at the jobs.gc.ca site for the simple reason that most heli jobs posted there, with the exception of RCMP, TC and CCG positions, are by operators who're actually building their case for a favorable labor opinion so they can raise work visas... :rolleyes:

 

I think it's important to mention that it's a very few operators who prefer foreign pilots to Canadian pilots. I don't mean to paint them all with the same brush with my comments... :lol:

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Time for operaters to step up and develop some young low time pilots and work with customers that are requiring these high minimums. This is not an easy task, and requires dedication and some expense on the part of the operator. Educate them on what true safety is, just because a foreign pilot has the hours does not make him capable, why do you think Canadian pilots are in such demand! They are well trained and well rounded.

Helicopter Companies always take the cheapest solution instead of working with and developing young talent which could lead to a dedicated employee.

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As a lowtimer who is (finally!) working in the industry, this topic is close to my heart. I work with quite a few folks from overseas, and I don't for one minute feel like they're "stealing my job" - they each have thousands of hours compared to my 230 or so. They're good guys (who have taught me a lot!), they've been in the country for a couple years; and as far as I know everyone is on the same pay scale no matter whether they are Canadian or foreign-born.

 

And that segues nicely into the whole minimum hour requirement discussion - although I'm working on my turbine endorsement and PPC, there will be little flying for me once I'm qualified as I'm still several hundred hours below most of our contract minimums. Those few hours each month that would be suitable for me to fly are divvied up amongst our R44 guys who all just got their turbine training and need to build their hours on type. I like my job and the people I work with, I like the wage and schedule, but - sadly - there's nowhere I can go here as long as the customer requirements stay like they are.

 

I hear (and read) lots about the looming experience gap and the need to develop low timers, but right now I feel that it's just talking points; it's hard to see things changing as long as there are enough qualified butts to fill the seats. Some argue that this is the reason to cut off all the work permits, but I don't think that would help - companies that are already scrambling to find work will also then be scrambling to find qualified pilots, and will be so engrossed in finding and keeping experienced pilots that they will have precious little time and financial wherewithal to devote to a good low timer mentoring program.

 

One can only hope that the shift to a competency-based requirement system does in fact become the norm. Until then, I'm happy to be working and getting the odd flight hour here and there. Could be worse!

 

 

If there are any qualified pilots out there with the desired personal skills (ie: are flexible and adaptable, are great with customers, possesses good communication and team work skills, has a strong work ethic, is professional and faces the day with a positive attitude...) AND are interested in relocating to the Yukon, working fulltime and has the aptitude and desire to run a base; now would be a good time to get in touch and send a resume.

 

 

It is a different lifestyle up here and certainly not suited for everyone. However, if you are a helicopter pilot who loves the outdoors, the mountains and everything that goes along with them, wants variety in your work in a challenging environment and wants to live in the north, there is no better place to be.

 

Wow, I'm your perfect candidate except for all that experience and skill part... My Mrs and I love the mountains, love the outdoors, and we'd both love to live in Whitehorse. Saaay, if you guys ever wanna develop a lowtimer, then I'm your huckleberry :D

 

 

 

- Darren

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Hey Vortex I'd like to know were that work is......other than a couple companies that put ad's out and them when you talk to them they tell you their just seeing what's out there atm. I got 17 years and I'm looking so I sure would be interested to know were all this work is your talking about.

We have plenty of experienced pilots here in Canada, I've worked for a company that took on foreign workers and believe me it wasn't because they could provide something us Canadian pilots were not able to..........it was all about green backs $$$$

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Is there not something in the works so that companies can pay their foreign hire 15% less than the going rate? We are in most cases making the least amount of money and have the longest rotation on any given job, this is all we need to lower the bar even further. No wonder so many guys are going international IFR !

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Here is the first question I get when talking to most new people in the industry. What will be the schedule? ie 2 and 2. This is from low time pilots and engineers who are new to the industry. When I was a low timer trying to get in the question was where am I moving to? Next question which airline will I be flying back and forth with. When I started it was what needs to be done around the base when I am not flying?

 

I live where I work and do not live in lotus land. When I go up town I see my customers at the hockey arena,grocery store or just on the street. I know my customers by their name and I know where they want to go when they get in my machine. Most of the crews that pass through my base comment how much they dislike the work we do. The oil and gas industry is a tough go but it is what it is.

 

The crews in this industry need a wake up. Live where you work.

 

The employers should recognize the workers that live where they work. When they fly workers in it costs for airfare,meals accommodation but you don't see the locals getting paid more for living at their bases.

 

Hour requirements a a huge problem. I started in 1991 with NMH. We got a 50 hour mountain/operational training course. Then we went to work In camps and at bases though out the companies work area. The were a fair amount of jobs that we could work at that we were qualified for. Now with contrail and others in the safety industry they have sold the 1000 or more hour safety program. Most of the work that I do a 200 hour pilot could do with the proper training and supervision. Contrails answer is you companies will find the qualified crews because you always have. The quality of personal is decreasing because any guys that are go getters are leaving because they get tired of starving. We can find crews now but in five years good luck. The cow chasers of the south won't be able to fill the gap anymore. We need a program to train young Local pilots and engineers to strengthen the industry. It should be put on the safety guys to develop this program because they control the regulations.

 

Sorry for the rant off to work I go hi oh hi ho.

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