Reliance Production Optimization

[drkrider]

I'm positive that a POC is required.

 

Also remember these are the types the commercial operators are competing against and the customers judge the whole industry by these guys who aren't even remotely doing things the safe an correct way.

 

DrkRider

[Whitestone]

Can't speak to how others do or did their maintenance but years back I worked for a non-aviation company that had a huge contract that required helicopter support. They crunched the numbers after using a commercial operator for a while and decided to get a machine of their own. It was privately registered and maintained to a commercial standard by an approved maintenance organization and other than not doing a PPC I conduced ops like a "regular" commercial operator. ...other than the fact that I hauled only people who worked for our company and their freight. Sure pissed off a couple of the local operators though.

 

W.

[Heliian]

. As far as I know, most, if not all police and ENG helicopters fly without an AOC...

 

 

 

All of the police aircraft are "state" registered and operated under commercial programs. ENG is aerial work and requires an AOC.

[Heli Jockey]

I'm positive that a POC is required.

 

Also remember these are the types the commercial operators are competing against and the customers judge the whole industry by these guys who aren't even remotely doing things the safe an correct way.

 

DrkRider

 

 

OK, well, I'm kind of a low time guy and you seem to be more in the know. I want to make sure we stay "above board", ya know?

 

Can you tell me:

a ) which model R22 is a large aeroplane?

b ) which model R22 has a turbine?

c ) which model R22 is pressurized?

d ) which model R22 has two (or more) engines?

 

I appreciate your feed back!

 

 

Subpart 4 — Private Operators

Division I — General Provisions

Interpretation

604.02 This Subpart applies to the following Canadian aircraft:

· (a) large aeroplanes;

· (b) turbine-powered aircraft;

· (c) pressurized aircraft; and

· (d) multi-engined aircraft.

I have no problems with you not liking the way the regulations are written. But maybe you should be mad at Transport Canada instead of the people that are following the regulations? Also, I think you do not know how many companies operate private aircraft.

[Skidz]

 

All of the police aircraft are "state" registered and operated under commercial programs. ENG is aerial work and requires an AOC.

 

ENG is aerial work if it's done for hire. If the aircraft is owned (or leased) and operated by the media that uses it for their own purposes, they need a POC if it's a turbine, but if it's a piston (ie R44), they need nothing at all. The way things are with TC these days, whoever is insuring the aircraft will pretty much dictate how stringent the operational standards need to be for their comfort...

 

We've gotten a little off-topic here with respect to the "charity" operation mentioned at the start of the topic.

 

Like I said before, the rules are what they are. As long as whoever is operating operates within those boundaries, I'm fine with that and we can't fault them for wanting to minimize costs. If a company like Reliance uses an R22 as the company truck, doesn't hire the machine out, and only carries company personnel in the aircraft, who are we to whine about them taking work away from operators who have way too many ships for the work available anyways ? They are working perfectly within the boundaries of the law. It's like a Fedex driver whining about helicopter companies having their own stores trucks to bring shipments to and from the airport taking work away from courriers. Or crew vehicles to get to and from crewhouses in lieu of taking cabs. Nonsense...

 

The case of these "volunteers" hiring out their services for crop warming while solliciting "donations" is clearly a violation of CARs.

 

Apples and oranges (or cherries if you prefer)

[Heliian]

What about the low time pilot they hire also as an "operator". Using the a/c heavily for lease to lease while not following any type of commercial regulation or training or maintenance or flight following. Does this low time pilot know the dangers? Will he be covered in case of an accident? If any industry can afford a higher level of service it's oil and gas. Are these "oilfield operators" being compensated by their customers for the helicopter time? Does the contract state helicopter use? Would they be paid the same using a pickup?

 

Personally, I think they are dangerously skirting the regulations and oblivious to it.

[Skidz]

I've flown operators around the gas fields. Trust me, the safest and easiest part of a pilot operator's job is the flying. It takes longer to train and be certified as a gas plant operator than it does to get a helicopter pilot's licence.

[Heli Jockey]

What about the low time pilot they hire also as an "operator". Using the a/c heavily for lease to lease while not following any type of commercial regulation or training or maintenance or flight following. Does this low time pilot know the dangers? Will he be covered in case of an accident? If any industry can afford a higher level of service it's oil and gas. Are these "oilfield operators" being compensated by their customers for the helicopter time? Does the contract state helicopter use? Would they be paid the same using a pickup?

 

Personally, I think they are dangerously skirting the regulations and oblivious to it.

 

First off, the billing and nature of the business plan is none of your business. Period.

 

EDIT: And just to point out, we aren't skirting the regulations, we are adhering to them.

 

And second, there is no such "good" job for low time guys.

Cherry drying? DANGEROUS!

Flight instruction? DANGEROUS!

Logging support? DANGEROUS!

Ferry passengers? DANGEROUS!

Fire fighting? DANGEROUS!

ENG? DANGEROUS!

Airial spraying? DANGEROUS!

 

Helicopters will kill all low time guys. So they should not fly until they have over 1000 hours and are thereby safe pilots.

[shakey]

Haha good one jockey. Or you could just hire an Aussie cause they are born with 3000 in their logbook.

[Heliian]

 

First off, the billing and nature of the business plan is none of your ...

I was speaking in general terms, not about your business.

 

The dangerous part isn't the flying you do it's your lack of knowledge and systems that is.