ORNGE Crash

[Blackmac]

1 hour ago, Freewheel said:

If I'm not mistaken, the local fixed wing operator safely departed and returned to that same airport not long  after the accident was reported...without NVGs

Been in that situation and I believe I made the proper decision.

In Sudan south of Khartoum at Chevron seis camp a gentleman had a heart attack in the middle of the night and I was asked to fly him into Bentu gravel airstrip to be picked up by fixed wing in the morning and flown into Khartoum.

Sudan at night is pitch BLACK.

Bell 212, not equipped for IFR, Pilot instrument rating, lapsed. Single Pilot VFR. Would have required at least two additional crew, including myself.

DECISION: Thinking back to my NAVY days on S@R on HU-21 Squadron, you do not jeopardize lives to save lives. There was no advantage for additional treatment in Bentu until the F/W arrived to take him out.

I made the call to take him out at first light, unfortunately he died during the night. I flew the body to Bentu. (confluence of the White and Blue Nile)

Don 

[just looking]

1 hour ago, shakey said:

Turn down enough flights and there will be a gun to your head (Career wise) Just a matter of time and you're done. You see it all the time in EMS in the states yet they still have crash after crash because there is always someone that will push safety just to please their bosses. You don't have to agree with me I respect that.

Thanks Shakey we will agree to disagree. I can say it is sure nice to engage in a conversation with someone that doesn't get into name calling when they disagree with an opinion.

 

[Bif]

On 9/1/2017 at 1:22 PM, just looking said:

Thanks Shakey we will agree to disagree. I can say it is sure nice to engage in a conversation with someone that doesn't get into name calling when they disagree with an opinion.

 

I'm pretty impressed this got back on track with constructive discussion after someone's poor attempt to derail the thread!

[Freewheel]

Judge clears ORNGE of Negligence and 17 Occupational Health and Safety Charges laid by Transport Canada 

http://torontosun.com/news/provincial/judge-clears-ornge-in-four-deaths

So if they weren't to respobsible, who was?

“The training and guidance provided to Transport Canada inspectors led to inconsistent and ineffective surveillance,” he said.

Fox said the system let the Ornge helicopter crew down by putting them in a situation for which they were not operationally ready. “This accident goes beyond the actions of a single flight crew,” she said.

[Freewheel]

https://www.ainonline.com/aviation-news/business-aviation/2017-11-14/ornge-cleared-2013-accident-charges

[Blackmac]

On 11/19/2017 at 5:40 PM, Freewheel said:

https://www.ainonline.com/aviation-news/business-aviation/2017-11-14/ornge-cleared-2013-accident-charges

One of the few people that seem to care about the Helicopter Industry in Canada, is the JUDGE who laid the blame for the accident, seems to have a better understanding of the cause, than most of the Industry. Transport Canada should be taken to court for not carrying out their MANDATE under orders of PARLIAMENT and the Minister of Transport. Not being a lawyer as any body can see, WHAT THE **** IS WRONG WITH H-A-C, their owners club has a LAWYER as president and could rock the boat as required. GET TO IT!!!!

[vortex]

2 hours ago, Blackmac said:

One of the few people that seem to care about the Helicopter Industry in Canada, is the JUDGE who laid the blame for the accident, seems to have a better understanding of the cause, than most of the Industry. Transport Canada should be taken to court for not carrying out their MANDATE under orders of PARLIAMENT and the Minister of Transport. Not being a lawyer as any body can see, WHAT THE **** IS WRONG WITH H-A-C, their owners club has a LAWYER as president and could rock the boat as required. GET TO IT!!!!

ORNGE is not an HAC member according to the website so the HAC would probably not feel obligated to help their side... What do you propose should be done?

[Freewheel]

6 hours ago, Blackmac said:

One of the few people that seem to care about the Helicopter Industry in Canada, is the JUDGE who laid the blame for the accident, seems to have a better understanding of the cause, than most of the Industry. Transport Canada should be taken to court for not carrying out their MANDATE under orders of PARLIAMENT and the Minister of Transport. Not being a lawyer as any body can see, WHAT THE **** IS WRONG WITH H-A-C, their owners club has a LAWYER as president and could rock the boat as required. GET TO IT!!!!

Im not sure what is worse:

failing to fulfill your mandate by choosing not to comply with your  own staff instructions and Minister's Directives (all while verifying an operator for compliance...the irony), or, 

"Trumping up" charges of negligence to distract from your own non-compliance (at the expense of safety and taxpayers while prolonging the closure for families)?

Many  of these issues could cone up in Civil litigation, but I'm betting TC will settle out of court to avoid having their surveillance practices brought up  and judged (and nothing will prevent it from happening again).

[Freewheel]

Here's the actual court documents for the judges ruling:

https://www.canlii.org/en/on/oncj/doc/2017/2017oncj750/2017oncj750.html?resultIndex=1

Much more detailed than the news articles.

[Blackmac]

On 11/28/2017 at 6:49 AM, Freewheel said:

Here's the actual court documents for the judges ruling:

https://www.canlii.org/en/on/oncj/doc/2017/2017oncj750/2017oncj750.html?resultIndex=1

Much more detailed than the news articles.

Thanks for keeping the wheels greased and the Court Documents.

I do believe quite a few organizations need to take a refresher course in "Risk Management", including Transport Canada and their so-called inspectors and ORNGE should have their Operating Certificate cancelled and turn the operation over to the private sector, who have to answer to the insurance companies to keep things inline.

Any other operator, operating in the fashion that ORNGE does, would have had their OC cancelled.

I'm still amazed that the industry is not talking to their local MP's and or the NDP.    GO TRANSPORT CANADA

Edited November 29, 2017 by Blackmac
comma