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EXP88

TRK Helicopters Heli Ski Accident

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On 2018-03-29 at 7:17 PM, EXP88 said:

WOW...this is an interesting read, some good lessons to learn for both rookie and veteran pilots.

Amazing that everyone wasn't killed.

Its downright miraculous.......

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Thats an interesting read.

 

Im interested in the ELT findings. I submitted an SDR (service difficulty report) about 6 years ago on the G switches. We were finding that 20 to 30% of our fleet were failing on the annual test. This is just another example where the ELT has failed to activate after an incident. Whithout the sat track unit and had the injuries been worse, this could have been a different story.  

We were mandated by Transport Canada to buy these junk 406 Elts years ago, and when they are alerted to a problem they do nothing. We all remember how flying in turbulence would set off the old units, now you need to pile the aircraft in at 10G to get the thing to go off (Maybee). It would be interesting to see the stats on how many crashes there has been, where the 406 failed to activate.

From a maintenance standpoint the only ICA I have seen is to do the self test evey 30 days. I have never heard of taking it out and shaking it every 4 months.

Has anyone else found they have had to replace the G switches?

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21 hours ago, hybrid said:

Its downright miraculous.......

Having seen one of the on board videos that was recorded by one of the passengers. All are very lucky to be alive. It is an excellent example of what can happen when pilots decide to give people the ride of their lives. This ride will never be forgotten by all on board, for all the wrong reasons. A joy ride gone bad.

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1 hour ago, Bell-powered said:

Pointing at elt and the push for voice and data recorders.....why should we raise the bar on training and procedures? As long as we have a better elt system... 

My comments aren’t related to this particular incident but procedures aren’t worth the paper their printed on if people don’t follow them, & as long as there are VFR pilots in the bush there will be the occasional “hot dogging”. You’re right about the ELT, by the time it is required to operate it’s too late but the CVR information can be used to develop more robust/relevant procedures.

Heli500 - We’ve had a 406 not activate after an incident severe enough to total the machine, luckily another machine was close by.

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AS much as i don't see any harm in a CVR, i also see little need. You mentioned Hot Dogging in the bush. You are correct it happens not just in the bush. Most of it happens when the pilot is the sole passenger. So i am not sure would good a CVR will do.

 

 

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3 hours ago, just looking said:

AS much as i don't see any harm in a CVR, i also see little need. You mentioned Hot Dogging in the bush. You are correct it happens not just in the bush. Most of it happens when the pilot is the sole passenger. So i am not sure would good a CVR will do.

 

 

CVR, dashcams & HUMS can have the same effect as the policeman sitting on the side of the road with a radar - if you know the policeman is there you tend to obey the speed limit. Generally the risk of receiving a penalty or disciplinary action is more of a deterrent to operating outside of a procedure than is the possibility of an accident as people generally think that an accident won’t happen to them, that’s why we keep having accidents. With the reliability of modern helicopters accidents/incidents are mostly due to pilot error so maybe as we transition to fully automated helicopters over the next few decades we’ll go through a period where the the cockpit will be plastered with “big brother” dash cams, recorders & alarms. Pretty simple in an A-star to connect a hydraulic pressure sensor to satellite tracking & send an alert to the Chief Pilot whenever the pressure increases to the maximum system pressure(servo transparency). How much hot dogging would go on if every pilot knew that the Chief Pilot would be waiting on the apron for them with their hands on their hips when they got back to base? Most machines these days have phones, I’m sure I’d rather take it easy than have the phone ring & the big boss asking me WTF I am doing!

a comment on this incident - 141 knots down to impact in 3 seconds & everyone walked away, wow.

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On 2018-04-02 at 12:58 PM, Heliduck said:

CVR, dashcams & HUMS can have the same effect as the policeman sitting on the side of the road with a radar - if you know the policeman is there you tend to obey the speed limit. Generally the risk of receiving a penalty or disciplinary action is more of a deterrent to operating outside of a procedure than is the possibility of an accident as people generally think that an accident won’t happen to them, that’s why we keep having accidents. With the reliability of modern helicopters accidents/incidents are mostly due to pilot error so maybe as we transition to fully automated helicopters over the next few decades we’ll go through a period where the the cockpit will be plastered with “big brother” dash cams, recorders & alarms. Pretty simple in an A-star to connect a hydraulic pressure sensor to satellite tracking & send an alert to the Chief Pilot whenever the pressure increases to the maximum system pressure(servo transparency). How much hot dogging would go on if every pilot knew that the Chief Pilot would be waiting on the apron for them with their hands on their hips when they got back to base? Most machines these days have phones, I’m sure I’d rather take it easy than have the phone ring & the big boss asking me WTF I am doing!

a comment on this incident - 141 knots down to impact in 3 seconds & everyone walked away, wow.

Excellent point Heliduck

Pretty simple in an A-star to connect a hydraulic pressure sensor to satellite tracking & send an alert to the Chief Pilot whenever the pressure increases to the maximum system pressure(servo transparency). How much hot dogging would go on if every pilot knew that the Chief Pilot would be waiting on the apron for them with their hands on their hips when they got back to base? Most machines these days have phones, I’m sure I’d rather take it easy than have the phone ring & the big boss asking me WTF I am doing!

It p*sses me off to no end when I hear stories like this. WTF is the pilot thinking. These innocent people have entrusted their lives in the pilots hands. They have no idea of the risks, etc. that can arise while hot dogging.

where is the PDM? Is there no forward thinking on the pilots part? No thought to the what if’s and mitigating risk rather than flirting with disaster. And where is the professionalism? 

Not to mention having to look at yourself in the mirror every morning. Knowing you killed or injured your trusting passenger(s) from one’s own reckless behavior.

pretty selfish behavior IMO.

 

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