New Fire Rules...

[Skids Up]

Wonder what everyone thoughts are on the proposed policy in Alberta, (or any other province) this year concerning the crews staying in tents on fires. Has anyone had any experience yet? I know it’s early in the season, but would like to know your thoughts.

 

Has any management set down any policies or statements to deal with it?

 

Would your company support your decision to refuse to stay in a tent?

 

Does your company have it’s own “minimum crew accommodation” guideline?

 

Do you believe that crews can “camp out” and still be fully rested to fulfill their duties in a safe manner?

 

Fire away people, let’s hear you views…

[412driver]

did we just step into a time machine???? :shock: :shock:

 

last time i slept in a tent was Mobile Bistcho in 91'..................

 

$%#*....they may as well ask me to work for free....answer would still be NO!

 

man, if thats the way it's going......these 300's are looking better and better!!

 

 

also, isn't there a regulation in CARS requiring crews to be lodged in a room that the temperature can be controlled???? something along those lines?

[Klipper]

Is this something forestry is proposing? or something that has come into effect already. It's just not going to fly!

[TwoPer]

Is this really happening? Or is just a rumour? I can't believe they would think this is going to work. It's been a battle to get to where we are now, it would seem ridiculous to have to start the same battle over again.

 

No, I don't believe you can be fully rested while sleeping in a tent and I haven't seen a tent yet with temperature control more advanced than a screen door.

 

You can bet the first guy to say "no" on every fire will be called down by forestry and threatened with being the first one released but will be the first guy to have the backing of the rest of the flight crews. So will the engineers have to stay in tents too so they can maintain the aircraft? Trying to get some much needed shut eye in the middle of the day in scorching sun drenched tent is always easy isn't it?!!?

 

Like 412 Driver just said, "Have we entered a time machine?"

[GoldMember]

As far as I know it is something that Alberta is saying to be prepared for. I don't know about the rest of you, but if I'm flying 8's every day (hopefully) I'm not staying in a nylon pup/dome tent. Bunch of Draconian bullsh*t if you ask me.

[Klipper]

well if we all say forget it shouldn't be an issue right?

[3BX2]

Forget about Alberta, come and fight fires in BC and stay in Town in Hotels.

 

Hmm, on second thought, leave the BC fires to me....and best of luck camping !

[T-rex]

Don't read between the lines! AFS is concerned about everyone's safety out there. I believe they are getting all the AFS line crews in tents where needed. Been on AFS for over 10 years, never been in a tent yet or saw any flight crews in tents yet! Been in a wooded framed sided and bottomed structure with a canvas roof! (EDRA BASE) Yikes.....!!!! But an actual tent on the ground.....no!

[skyward]

I really wonder?? This has been an issue for a long time. I really get a kick out the fact that these people (Forestry, primarily Alberta) have got their heads in another world when it comes to crew accomodations. I also find it less than humorous that TC have no qualms to ramp you and your aircraft, but when was the last time you seen then wandering around a fire base inspecting the living arrangements? The last time I was on a fire in Alberta we were actually staying in a motel, at least for the first 2 days. Then someone had a brainstorm to relocate us closer to the fire (a ten minute drive down the road) and put us in a gravel pit in "Atco Work Ovens". This tactic really amazes me! Are they thinking saving $$$? The accomodation has to be the smallest cost component of any fire budget. But what are the ramifications of staying in these PLF's (Primitive Living Facilities)? The answer is peoples lives. If you aren't obtaining a proper rest after a long days work, you can throw those flight/duty limits out the window because you may be too fatigued to reach them. I have also worked on fires in Sask, and I noticed that the tanker groups (although they are an airstrip based operation) did not stay the sleeping facilities at the fire base, they stayed at the local motel. (Wonder why?) Like the other comments, you have to glance at the date on the calender (year 2005) and give you're head a shake. And getting back to TC's standards, its gotta be hard to determine how many lives have been saved because of the vigilant scrutany of the compass correction card date. Must be thousands! And they wonder how a pilot, fresh out of recurrent training, could have possibly forgot he still had his longline attached when he departed the camp and snagged it on tree and crashed. I really wonder???

[GoldMember]

Capt. Krusty,

 

A wall tent I don't have an issue with. Staying in a small nylon tent on the ground for an entire tour? Not happening. AFS wants us to provide our own tents so that we have alternate means of accomodation, with the idea being that on an IA target the pilot can stay with the crew as opposed to returning to base before dark. I say no way Jose because I see this as the thin edge of the wedge. Initially we'll carry these "just in case" tents and eventually we'll be staying in tent cities on a project fire. Yes, firefighters stay in tents, but they do a fourteen day tour max.