Contrail Requirements Keep Canadians On E.i

[407 Driver]

Vermouth, There's always a way to find a negative in any comment, you seem to have succeeded.

 

The initial point being, if you treat crew well, one does not need to be constantly short handed, even with an industry wide shortage.

 

Back to your negative point, Yes, if you crew 20+ - 212's with 2 pilots and 2 engineers per ship, and the fire season turns out low, some have sat. An interesting fact of the fleet is that the crews are needed for the WINTER season.

[bladethrow]

Vermouth

 

It's not out of choice, it out of nessesity that higher time pilot cannot work for peanuts. I'll spell it out more clearly so bthat you are clear on the situation from begining to end.

 

 

Recently there was a company that was looking for experienced pilots that where to stop by for a coffee. Well I tell you that a mature responsible adult with normal family sized bills doesn't just take a flight out to alberta for a cup of coffee without some assurace that the costs for travel are covered. (UNREALISTIC HIRING PROCESS). So we haven't even got to the wage negotiation stage yet and the pilot is expected to cover unrealistic costs- Just one of many exaples of unreaistic un proffesional hiring practices.

 

Now to wages, As you may be aware the cost to raise a family these days on a single income is pretty tough, so anything less that 60K per year is almost undoable, after deductions, $1500 per month for the mortgage, vehicle insurace, cloths for the kids,insurance,fuel, school supplies ect. well I am pretty sure that this is clear. Combined with the large probability that the job will take any peron away from home for more than half a year there must be additional consideration for this as well. Top the whole thing off with the sense of absolutely no job security

and at will employment layoffs the picture looks bleak.

 

Today, I work in the construction field, with no qualifications at all make 60K per year as a operations manager for 20 or so guys, am home every night, don't have to deal with overblown egos or sketchy hiring practices and a great deal less bull shite.

 

When one considers the training and costs to become a Helicopter pilot the rewards and conditions thereof are small. 2 years ago I was working for the Eastern Czar and was having a little chat with one of the cleaning staff at a SEBJ camp and was shock to learn that a Janitorial position was paying almost 25% more than I was being paid. My draw dropped in disbelief- true however.

 

It's not that I think I am worth a whole bunch but a 50K worth of training and 10 years of industy experience has got to be worth something more than a job as a Janitor.

 

 

Just the facts.

[MRA]

As low time pilots we are sold a false bill of goods. We are told we have to work harder then anyone else and work for peanuts if we have. Hours are all that matter. I would like to know who was propagating that message.

 

Then we are condemned by high-time pilots for driving wages down. As well as given no respect by operators who want you to work for nothing.

 

All I want to do is fly. Maybe I am being overly romantic, but let me know if anyone else’s ideals were any different when they started.

 

I am sure some guys got fair paying jobs right out of school. Although I am guessing most didn't. I would like to stop guessing- would any long time pilots like to share their sordid stories of their beginnings in the industry?

 

Then we low time guys can not only set our sites on flying but also help the industry as a whole by knowing exactly what we are worth and what not to put up with.

 

NO body in any industry is worth peanuts!

 

MRA

[Phil Croucher]

The sad fact is that there will always be someone who will work for nothing to get the hours in - it's happening right in the next company to me in UK.

 

I don't know what the answer is - all I know is that whoever I hire to do the same job as others gets the same pay as others, and I deliberately put people who offer to work for nothing or pay for type ratings etc at the bottom of the pile - I want people with a little more self-esteem than that, then they will likely not fall for some of the tricks that customers like to pull.

 

The best advice I can offer is get another skill with which you can make a living and like almost as much as flying. Then train yourself to regard flying as a business. You are then better able to stick up for yourself. I've worked in Staples rather than fly a helo for nothing because it's not fair to others.

 

But then, maybe I'm unusual!

 

Phil

[bladethrow]

MRA

 

You are absolutely correct, you are being sold a false set of goods, what the operator is counting on is your undying love of flying so that he can offer unreaistic terms and conditions. Having travelled this path and all the uncertainties and BS the industry puts up, I decided that it was time to just settle into something else for the time being until the right job comes up that will compensate me for the more than of decade of experience and "Professional" qualifications I have built. Unfortunately there still remains a great number of pilots who are blinded by the dream of flight as I was. I still love flying but not at the expense of uncertain employment terms poor wages and frankly too much BS.

 

I do sincerly hope you find your way to security and good job with a genuine company that looks out for its employees, but don't cross your fingers.

 

As for the duct tape , it was VIH and a former northern Mountain debauchalized machine, my complaining about the matter helped me out the door.

 

[amodao]

A job is what you make it, if you are happy at what you are doing then good for you.

If you are unhappy, quit. You will make everyone around you happier when you go away.

Boo Who, I'm to fat, I'm to ugly, my job sucks...........Blah Blah Blah!

[Deep Throat II]

Very well said Amodao,lets call a spade a spade here boys.

 

DTII

[407 Driver]

Amodao :up:

[Vermouth]

Bladethrow,

 

Perhaps if you applied yourself and g.o.y.a. you would see many companies are evolving and are now willing to pay 70K to 100K, with security, benefits, weekends off and I'd bet they would supply you the trip to the coffee shop.... heck even the coffee. Only the occasional application of polysporen to your rugburn.

[bladethrow]

Amadoa,407,Deepthroat2

 

I agree completely agree if you are not happy with your job move on. I did just that as well as many other highertime pilots that have had enough, of low wages, uncertain working terms and BS. Unfortunately the helicopter flight training institutions function on the premis of perpetuating false hopes.

 

For me it was easy to get into the industry after a year or two of eating crow.

 

I still love flying, and will cherish those times before the industry started downhill and the general comportment slid to all time low.

 

I have a great deal of faith that there is light at the end of the tunnel and several of the drawbridge mentality practices that have become more coomon place will under some form of reform come to an end and an average person can seek security with the industry once again.

 

What is certain is that the owners of the companies will not ever change or bring employment security to the industry. There stand will continue to be "If you don't like it too bad"

 

So yes let's call a spade a spade.