Landing on water

[vortex]

One thing that I've used for landing on glassy water (if a shore reference is too far away to use) is your shadow. If its a flat light day & glassy water :down: - be very afraid - you might want to use the shore to touchdown then head to where you've gotta go. Landing in a fast river adds a whole bunch of issues to float flying and is an art to do well. Current is often more important than wind for touchdown but wind is more important than current for your approach, so choose your poison wisely. :shock: Good challenging flying in any type of machine. :up:

[twinstar_ca]

Current is often more important than wind for touchdown but wind is more important than current for your approach, so choose your poison wisely. :shock: Good challenging flying in any type of machine. :up:

 

so what would be the technique, vortex?? do you come to a hover into the wind, then pedal turn to get the current advantage or touch down 1st and fly the machine downwind on the water??

 

and don, agreed... a little thanks to all the good advice given by all of you would have been appropriate and even nice...

[vortex]

I guess I was a little vague on what I find is the best way to touchdown in a river but its a little difficult to have a really firm rule for approaching. The main thing is to always touchdown with the current (same speed, same direction) Approach is sometimes a judgement call. e.g. river speed = 7 knots from the north, wind speed = 5 knots from the north means you touchdown with 2 knots on the nose. I have come to an IGE hover into wind then turned downstream for touchdown. It is a difficult thing to judge river speeds and wind speeds at times and sometimes you just end up doing what feels right - and sometimes you're "getting experience" :shock:Oh yeah, and sometimes if the wind or the current is too strong, I just say no..

Edited November 9, 2005 by vortex

[Charles W.]

I had a R22 Mariner in my flight school some moons ago and it was a fun machine.

 

I did not really get to do much water landing but enough to know that you must be very careful hovering with no wind as there is no way to see movement sideways, backwards, etc. without something to judge movemment by such as close to the shore or a bouy or some such thing a dymamic f.ck up is easy to perform.

 

Rev.

[twinstar_ca]

thanks for clarifying that, vortex... you pretty much confirmed what i thought you meant!!

 

along with what both you and the rev have said, pucker factor no doubt is a good benchmark to just say no sometimes!!! :up:

[Charles W.]

I thought someone would comment on my use of a new term.

 

Rev

[Guest Bullet Remington]

REV!

 

Good to hear you back here!!

 

Oh, was workin with one of tho fuggin Pinky Engineers this week, and your name came up! He was tellin a story about the "guy" (Insert your name here!!) and i started laughing!!

 

He asked if I knew you and I asked, "Don't everybody??"

 

His Grand Father owned an Engine Shop over in Calgary, GrandFather also owned a Navion, as does the Pinky Winky!

 

You no doubt know to whom I referr!!

 

Jassuss bye, we gotta get together and start fixing the canadian Aviation racket!! :up:

[T tail]

Yeah sorry blackmac...good advice all round, If i ever have to land on the stuff I will let you know what happens :up: , hopefully it will stay right side up

 

Cheers TT

[chopper_guy]

Since I have NEVER landed on water..just asking how it is done????? do you treat it like snow and try and stay out of your snowball/waterspray as long as possible, even a very slight run on??? I have flown around it lots using the waters edge etc that loss of depth perception is scary stuff :shock:...I read once too that on startup the machine can yaw due to lack of tail rotor effectivness ???

 

Anyone

 

CHeers TT

For snow landings you either hover high to wait for the snow to blow away or do an immediate landing with some forward movement touching down before the downwash obscures your reference, or come to a low hover over a reference point that will not blow away, then touch down

Some important factors for float operations;

-Start up or shut down either strongly tied to a solid dock, with someone briefed on untying you safely, or maybe 100 yards from shore, with no possibility of being blown to shore before the blades are stopped. The machine will spin depending on wind and throttle applied. Have a good place to get to shore downwind from your shut down spot.

-Paddling straight may be difficult since you are probably sitting off-centre on one float.

-on glassy water always set down close to shore. A little forward motion is a good idea since you don't want to set down going backwards. Use the shoreline or waves for reference. Using downwash as reference can be very disorienting.

-obviously, no sudden or extreme rear cyclic movements

-Keep the floats pumped hard unless you will be gaining much altitude. They will pop if you're not careful. There will be a big diference in pressure between morning and afternoon. For land set downs slightly lower pressure may prevent punctures.

-Keep a patch kit with you along with your pump. You will definately need life vests for everyone on board. Keep a small oil can to lubricate the pump. I have operated floats at -40 deg (a long atory). The pump will have to be preheated and kept warm for decent operation.

-landing on moving water, a shore reference is even more critical

-Remenber the special lower gross weights for floats and the loss in performance caused by the extra weight and rotor downwash blanking.

[transientorque2]

For snow landings you either hover high to wait for the snow to blow away or do an immediate landing with some forward movement touching down before the downwash obscures your reference, or come to a low hover over a reference point that will not blow away, then touch down

Some important factors for float operations;

-Start up or shut down either strongly tied to a solid dock, with someone briefed on untying you safely, or maybe 100 yards from shore, with no possibility of being blown to shore before the blades are stopped. The machine will spin depending on wind and throttle applied. Have a good place to get to shore downwind from your shut down spot.

-Paddling straight may be difficult since you are probably sitting off-centre on one float.

-on glassy water always set down close to shore. A little forward motion is a good idea since you don't want to set down going backwards. Use the shoreline or waves for reference. Using downwash as reference can be very disorienting.

-obviously, no sudden or extreme rear cyclic movements

-Keep the floats pumped hard unless you will be gaining much altitude. They will pop if you're not careful. There will be a big diference in pressure between morning and afternoon. For land set downs slightly lower pressure may prevent punctures.

-Keep a patch kit with you along with your pump. You will definately need life vests for everyone on board. Keep a small oil can to lubricate the pump. I have operated floats at -40 deg (a long atory). The pump will have to be preheated and kept warm for decent operation.

-landing on moving water, a shore reference is even more critical

-Remenber the special lower gross weights for floats and the loss in performance caused by the extra weight and rotor downwash blanking.

 

 

That kind of sums it up. Very good indeed. Too bad Bell doesn't have this info in the flight manual. This knoledge would go a long way for those who do not have formal float training.