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Don't worry, I know the remark was a tongue-in-cheek, but I have always felt that the customer has way too much input in N America. If I get into a taxi, I don't routinely tell the guy how to do his job. Similarly, as a Chief Pilot, I don't see why I can't choose people who I think are best for the job in hand, as long as they are properly licensed and rated, of course. But then, that is my European background talking!

 

Phil

Would you have said something to the taxi driver Phil if he ran a red light, and almost t-boned someone while you were a passenger?? I do take a bit of exception of your blanket statement about customer input in N.America. Any customer has a right to ask for experienced and qualified flight crew(s) to carry out the requested work they are about to pay for? "Properly licensed and rated" does not insure the experience level is there to perform any specialized/difficult job that may arise, safety is paramount. Having said that, i can not think off the top of my head, to many managers, that are willing to allow a customer to dictate.....good management works with the customers. And we do it just as well here in comparison, to anywhere else in this global industry.

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I think that this Contrail chap might be up for a rather rude awakening when the bollocks he produces reaches deeper into the international aviation groups of some of the larger Oil and Gas producers, who have a rather more practical and pragmatic approach to helicopter safety, principally as a result of rather tragic accidents involving their vendors, contractors and employees.

 

I for one remember the good old days on the North Sea, when Pilots went to work wearing airline uniforms, gold braid, ties and hats! :shock: Of course none of this get-up provided the slightest bit of protection should you have the misfortune to find yourself floating around in the sea! After a couple of close shaves, they suddenly realised that perhaps safety might be better saved by wearing immersion suits, real life-jackets and training people on how to survive should they find themselves in this circumstance.

 

I think this Gentleman might be be better served in ensuring that individuals in this region are fully equipped to survive with modern hi-tech survival safety clothing, not some kind of gay airline uniform. Nomex Fleece, Gortex, proper headwear, footwear and location devices, real personal protective equipment.

 

But on the other hand, he probably believes that a Twin-Star is safer than an A-Star and two pilots are better than one in VFR operations! :wacko:

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But on the other hand, he probably believes that a Twin-Star is safer than an A-Star and two pilots are better than one in VFR operations! :wacko:

 

 

He absolutely does... or did in the not so distant past... I have heard him expound many opinions on such things...

 

The basic problem is having an intelligent fellow (who is obviously very articulate and convincing), who happens to lack any real experience in the field he is supposedly "expert" in, having an unopposed channel into the oil company "mover and shaker" offices.

 

I just hope that sooner rather than later he either tempers his recommendations with a little common sense, or, even better, the clients ask us to audit the auditor!! I can already feel the writer's cramp...

 

HV

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Albert Ross ------ it is WE have have ALLOWED the customer to have "too much input" in many cases. It is WE who have the largest and OLDEST fleet of R/W in the Free World and it is WE who know why that is.........because WE can't afford the new a/c........ and can only buy the used......and WE know we aren't getting anywhere what WE should for those a/c that we can afford. In 1968 I was earning $17,000/yr and according to StatsCan I was in the top 11% that year for Canadian wage-earners. How many R/W pilots do you know nowadays that are in the top 11% of wage-earners? I haven't been in that top 11% since the air was clean and sex was dirty.

 

Also have no fear about comparing us and taxicab drivers either. They don't have medicals like we do; don't have check-rides once a year or more often like we do; don't have their accidents spread all over the newspapers like we do; aren't considered "old" at 40 like we are and aren't compared to trapeze artists in a circus when we apply for Life Insurance. If we don't obey "red lights" then the Tower will cite us or ignoring them in an a/c may cause us to fall out of the sky. We also are allowed to carry drunks only when we do not discern it and are not allowed to accept Welfare Cheques for payment unless Certified. Hanging-out in front of the local pub at 1AM in the morning, looking for fare-paying rides with our a/c is also frowned upon by upper management and MoT.

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Skids Up ------ ****, I can't EVEN be a cab driver because I can't afford the material for the turban.......er hat, hankerchief.......ahhhhh you know what I mean. :lol:

 

N1............ please be careful with the term "gay uniforms". Should Contrail read or hear of such a term, well............. next thing he'll be suggesting is that finely tailored, pink-satin, flight suits indicate "professionalism" and safety.

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****, I know there's a difference between us and taxi drivers (isn't there? :)) - I just used that as an example, but let's make a better one - I wouldn't routinely expect to tell a surgeon how to do his job, but would hope to rely on his expert knowledge. However, if the b*gger "runs a red light", then be assured I will either get out or give him some wall-to-wall counselling. What you have to ask is why the customer has so much input - as Cap so rightly says, it's WE who have allowed it by taking short cuts and running the equivalent of red lights so much that we are now no longer trusted, hence the customer input.

 

As a professional, I expect to be allowed to get on with my job with the minimum of direction, which is what I have where I am now employed. That doesn't (often) happen in N America, and I think that situation is wrong - that's the reason why you have people like Contrail, which is no great problem as long as what comes out of their office has some common sense and knowledge behind it. By the look of the above posts, I don't happen to believe that much of it does, and I speak as a registered consultant who operates in the same field in many other countries.

 

The customers should be coming to US for advice, and yet they are going to people like Contrail. There's a problem which should be addressed!

 

Phil

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As a professional, I expect to be allowed to get on with my job with the minimum of direction, which is what I have where I am now employed. That doesn't (often) happen in N America, and I think that situation is wrong

 

The customers should be coming to US for advice, and yet they are going to people like Contrail. There's a problem which should be addressed!

 

Phil

 

Geez Phil.......believe it or not, there are no shortage of companies here on the west coast of Canada, that do just that....allow us, as flight crew to do our jobs with minimal interference. Maybe i've been lucky in my 30 years, but any input from customers we were working for, was for the benefit of safety and yes, also efficiency.

The odd time when i was asked to perhaps move weights that would exceed aircraft performance, an educated and professional responce usually managed to take care of the situation....same for weather....."always" my/our call. And we made **** sure we backed our flight crews when safety was at issue.

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So you've never had a customer complain because you didn't use the GPS to get you round the leases? If I am able to get the guy where he wants to go and calculate it all in my head, I fail to see why it's any of his business how I do it!

 

If a fork lift driver can tell a customer he can only take 50 packets on his fork lift, I don't expect to be called a liar when I say the same thing, or be threatened with physical violence when a load is dropped after they have been told that that is what will happen, as was mentioned in a recent thread on this forum.

 

And neither do I expect zero support from the management!

 

You sure have been lucky in your 30 years!

 

phil

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