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It doesn’t seem that this is about rule making, TC make the rules that we have to abide by. This “private safety consultant” is making recommendations to your customers, and probably making a big buck at it.


I have mentioned in the company I work for, that we (company) should be going to all our customers with a packaged, well planned presentation on why we operate the way we do. To explain why we can’t fill all the seats on a hot day and head to the mountaintop, vertical out of the hole, or land everywhere they want to. To explain how density/heat affect the performance. Why pads should be constructed a certain way, why some landing areas should be picked over others. Etc, etc, etc…


There is much that could be done proactively, and by doing so, would remove any input that would come from such an individual that is being discussed here.


But we don’t. Why not? Because, we have always flown for this customer, we have no competition in this area, they won’t listen, what’s the point, (keep adding your own excuses here…).


Funny why they won’t listen to us, but will listen to him.

So go forth and set the standards and get your own approvals.


It would be nice to fly with a 1000’ ceiling and 3 miles vis all the time, but is it necessary? Probably not, as we have all flown in worse. (But wouldn't it be nice to have them say 1/2 or 1 mile in snow is just not good enough, and know they won't go across the street and try on the next operator!) So go to the customer and explain all of this. Don’t want to wear a white shirt and tie? Go to the customer and explain why this is of no benefit to them.


Two things are going to change the industry. Us or them. It will not stay the same, no matter what we have always done, or what has always worked. Do we want it to change? Probably not. Because we’re comfortable with it and why fix it if it ain’t broken…?


But remember, only you (all of us) can and do allow others to change the rules, and if we don’t take the lead, then we will be lead.



You've got a good point there.

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Yes Elvis We remember Ron S. well ( He always had his VISA card with him - remember that TV add? ) :lol: but he wasn't the only one to do 2 machines in less than a week - I think Streve R. ( RIP) did 2 206s on bags - one for Dom Peg and one for Heli on the hydrology contract in Attila spring 74. :blink:

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Well felow crew members I know how most feel when the rules are being changed and for what seems to be only to satify someones ego. I think that when Joe Co. comes through the door with their new safety rules i.e. 3miles and 1500 ft make sure you do not fly that customer. Make sure you advise them that you and you other A/C off you base can and will be flying for someone else as there are nor rules being brocken it is just their Co rules that you can not and will not bend until you have a letter of clerance from their head office. I know from past experiance that once it starts to cost money or lost production there will be a change back to the tried and true. In other words beat them at their own game, play by their rules and do not bend

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sounds like a great idea, but unfortunately there might be a fine line that may hurt you more than them. How do you pressure a customer to bend to your ways when safety is involved? They hired and adopted contrails rules because they have safety in mind, to tell them you won't work for them because you don't believe in the new safety rules won't fly, it just looks bad. As well, comparing this to tarriff rates there is always someone willing to fly for less, same thing will go for this idea. Comany A says "no go", Company B goes " Yee Haa, we got a job". How do you really win ?

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Yes Elvis We remember Ron S. well ( He always had his VISA card with him - remember that TV add? ) :lol: but he wasn't the only one to do 2 machines in less than a week - I think Streve R. ( RIP) did 2 206s on bags - one for Dom Peg and one for Heli on the hydrology contract in Attila spring 74. :blink:



Sharkie the point I was going for is he landed that job as a saftey dude in the first place.


I was in one of the camps when he did an inspection tour shortly after Dom-Peg had another incident on the QNS&L and he made the comment about the high accident rate they were having.


When I commented his 2 in 5 days didn't help he was at a lose for words.


PS. I remember the Visa adds and the lose of Steve R.



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Personally, I would invite this gentleman to put his rules in place concerning the 1000' ceiling. I would also invite him to institute them with oil and gas companies in northern BC and AB who are trying to maintain their extensive fields on a daily basis. After approximately ONE week, he will find out that he's been a dismal failure because he forgot something REAL important about northern BC and AB.........he forgot to take note of all the days and weeks when the weather is fine, but there ain't no 1000' ceiling. If your business depends upon such minimums being maintained, then you cease to function as a business entity in those areas and you might as well pack up and go home.


I'd strongly suggest that it will be the President of Contrail WHO will be "sent packing" shortly after he has his ideas accepted within those above areas.......whether he wearing a "high-collared" shirt or not.

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thanks for reiterating what i've said before.


I'm sure his days, or presence, will be limited in the long run.

The only way his ceiling limits would have any clout, is if he has documented proof that flying low is a safety concern. To my knowledge, at least 90% of the accidents happen at ground level, so he may be on to something :blink:

Of all the helicicopter pilots I know, give them unlimited ceilings, and where do you find them flying??? About 500-1000' anyway.

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