Why Do We Spend So Many Days Away?

[skyward]

Well said Jet B. Remember, without your family you have nothing! Why can't people figure that out.

 

VX

 

I second the "Well said Jet B". You know its an amasing fact that Transport Canada have implemented a restriction of flight/duty time to prevent or at least lower the accident rates based on fatigue. What I have noticed is that when it comes to the "Duty Time" restriction, they fall short of the mark. I have been in the business for 26 years now and have worked all sorts of schedules and what I have noticed is that there is rarely any importance of the family structure being preserved. It would seem to me that with all the $$$ spent on medical studies to establish fatigue limits that they invariably leave out a coulple of vital details. (1) What type of work is being done? (2) What are the living standards of accomodation? and to me the most important, (3) how long have you been on the job? I may be speaking from a biased base here as I have a family, but from what has been said from earlier comments, most people do not choose to remain single or have become single primarily as a result of rarely being home.

 

What the irony is with all this is the fact as stated by a small few, that the industry cannot afford the increased expenxse of more frequent travel, yet when it comes to the expense of accident investigations, wrecked aircraft, life insurance claims, divorce claims, on and on...... there seems to be an endless supply??? Now, am I "Whinning" by stating the obvious. I tend to think not. But the thing that really grates me is when there is an accident, and there are fatalities involved, and the accident report claims "Pilot error", there is never any facts as to WHY the pilot acted as he did. I don't know how many times I have heard the line "He just made a stupid mistake" Where I'm going with all this is maybe some of us have lives other than just this glory filled carreer and when we have been away from home for extended periods of time, for some strange reason we start to drift away from the task at hand and long for the moment to see our families again.

 

I hate more rules and regulation just as much as the next guy, but maybe this tour length topic should be addressed the same way as any other requirement that has been implemented to impove safety. It wouldn't prejudice any particular operator as everyone would be in the same boat and rates would have to be raised accross the board to cover the increased cost of doing business.

 

Cheers.

 

 

 

Sorry for the duplicate post

[twinstar_ca]

duplicate fixed, skyward!!

[Guest bag swinnger]

Very well put Skyward!

[Blackmac]

Jet B, Skyward:

 

You both make very good points with respect to a standard of living.

 

Skyward, with you being in the industry for 26 years, you are aware of the industry prior to de-regulation in 87. What do you think of the industry now after de-regulation????

 

I personally think it stinks.

 

I assumed once HAC was formed, that it was going to be along the lines of HAI. Big mistake.

 

HAC was formed as an owners organization for there benefit only.

 

As it stands now HAC only hands out to there employees what they can get away with. Indeed not all companies are the same.

 

But uniformity in this industry will only happen thru regulation and/or an association and willingness of the individuals.

 

One voice is very faint, 500 to 1000 can create an uproar and it does'nt have to be a union.

 

IMHO

 

Cheers, Don

[BDJ]

I agree we all look forward to change but untill the operators raise their rates it will not happen. $60.00 plus per barrell and we are still getting the same rates as when it was $25.00 Time to demand more for improved service !!

[Sailbad_the_Sinner]

Hi folks

 

I see that most are not happy with their work sched and I guess rightly so. In most cases it is hard on the home life. But, didn't you know what you were getting into when you signed on the dotted line? It might not seem so hard when you were a young fire-pisser with a "c-note" of hours and probably single. Were the wives/gf's etc aware of the potential of you being away when you signed on to a new company? Should maybe they have signed on the dotted line also? I do know what it's like to be away also. I spend 6 months and 1500 miles away from my home and family. Is it hard?...you betcha!!...is it worth it?...you betcha...my wife knew this would be happening and she accepted it. In the long run, I won't have to do it and be separated anymore. But right now when I'm away I still enjoy getting up and going to work every day....

 

Cheers

 

SS

[skyward]

Hi folks

 

I see that most are not happy with their work sched and I guess rightly so. In most cases it is hard on the home life. But, didn't you know what you were getting into when you signed on the dotted line? It might not seem so hard when you were a young fire-pisser with a "c-note" of hours and probably single. Were the wives/gf's etc aware of the potential of you being away when you signed on to a new company? Should maybe they have signed on the dotted line also? I do know what it's like to be away also. I spend 6 months and 1500 miles away from my home and family. Is it hard?...you betcha!!...is it worth it?...you betcha...my wife knew this would be happening and she accepted it. In the long run, I won't have to do it and be separated anymore. But right now when I'm away I still enjoy getting up and going to work every day....

 

Cheers

 

SS

I don't think this argument adds justification to the issue at hand. I think as I have stated earlier, the current standard regarding tour length has to change to keep in pace with the rest of the regulations we have had to follow in order to increase the standard of safety that the " Customer" demands. eg.shoulder harnesses, high vis blades, weight & balance, min # hour requirements,etc,etc. Maybe there is another way around this difficulty that the HAC can come up with to sweep this issue aside. Maybe spend a few million $$$ and develope a medical procedure that would block all thought patterns that initiate a sence of missing your loved ones after 30 days

 

By the way, I know your wife was well informed about your length of tours prior to you entering into the business, but I'd be curious to know if the kids are as keen and understanding as your wife is? I know mine aren't. Maybe they're too youg to understand. Shame is by the time they do, if they do, its will be a tad too late!

[Auto Relight]

Good points there Skyward.

 

I personally feel that with all the regulations we have to promote "safety," the major loophole at the moment is fatigue - the chronic 42 day kind.

 

I have seen three accidents/major incedents in the past two years where the pilot was at day 40 or more in a so called tour. I say so called because some contract guys have been known to take the odd day off and work all summer. Or how many times have we all extended by counting a wx day as a day off? If you have 5000hrs and are exhausted, you're no good to anyone.

 

The U.S. military has some very indepth information on fatige and how it applies to the aviation community, if anyone's interested.

 

Shortening tours is not just about family life issues, and to say "that's what you signed up for," is to trivialize the issue and prevent any meaningful change to occure.

 

AR

[skyward]

Good points there Skyward.

 

I personally feel that with all the regulations we have to promote "safety," the major loophole at the moment is fatigue - the chronic 42 day kind.

 

I have seen three accidents/major incedents in the past two years where the pilot was at day 40 or more in a so called tour. I say so called because some contract guys have been known to take the odd day off and work all summer. Or how many times have we all extended by counting a wx day as a day off? If you have 5000hrs and are exhausted, you're no good to anyone.

 

The U.S. military has some very indepth information on fatige and how it applies to the aviation community, if anyone's interested.

 

Shortening tours is not just about family life issues, and to say "that's what you signed up for," is to trivialize the issue and prevent any meaningful change to occure.

 

AR

 

Great echo AR. Now we just have to find a way to convince the powers to be to implement the changes. I presume that the fixed wing sector have already been down this road before, hence the creation of the CALPA. Voice in numbers. I just wish I had the insight of the importance of this earlier in my career. "Blinded by the light", (glory) I guess.

[Helilog56]

When you read these posts, it really ads strength to Blackmacs point....doesn' it????