Afghanistan Rescue Mission

[Kyle]

Sorry folks, never talk on the phone when clicking the mouse.

 

Here is the conversation as it stodd prior to the accidental removal.

 

Chopper_Stew wrote:

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I just thought I should take a few moments to mention this amongst all the news of other great rescues going on these days. All brought to you, of course, via the small community of competent capable aviators with balls of steel and hearts of gold. Also, a giant hand to the Brit's who are certainly in the thick of things in the Helmand province of southern Afghanistan at the moment, and have been for quite some time.

 

For those of you out there who think camp life is "bollocks" and don't want to hear anything more from the Ops manager, just remember that things could be worse. You could be one of the four lads on the way back into the fray. On the wings of an Apache.

 

 

 

Fenestron wrote:

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so...in war time......you becomes hero's.....

 

during ski season, rescuing a fallen snowboarder hanging onto the skids of a 407 would be????

 

You see what I'm getting at hopefully, and it's no different than low level military flying versus so called "stunting" in the civilian world. Two different balls of wax that seem to get intertwined religiously on here.

 

Kudo's to the guys who took the risk.

 

 

Mac-Ex-wafu wrote:

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The difference between the two different areas of operation is that in one you have some crazy fecker trying to shoot you and your crew out of the sky and kill you,,, the other,,, you have a snowboarder!

 

A big BZ goes out to the crew in question

 

 

transquebecniece wrote:

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Unbelievable. Uncommon valor, to say the least.

 

 

cactus23 wrote:

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Yes your right about in war people shooting at you and trying to kill you, but if you look closely your typical heli-skier and guide are trying to kill you all the time also.

 

I give those men and woman alot of respect for the jobs they do in Iraq and the sacrifice they give to do it. Yes they are tow different worlds in which they are both tough at times.

 

 

cap wrote:

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I've been in both enviroments gentlemen and there is NO possible way to compare the two. To even attempt to do so shows ignorance and that's with all due respect to everyone's opinion. They both deserve "Kudos"

 

 

Fenestron wrote:

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i would never have expected you Cap, to see what I was trying to point out.

In my school days I was taught that the earth revloved around the sun. someone must think different.

 

To everyone else, look at this video, look at the river run video and look at the 105 low level video....they all have the same cowboy cavaliar attitude, and that links them all, regardless of whether you think they are hero's or zero's. the same things people cut up those two latter video's about, are also in the apache video....so it's clear there is a double standard.

In my opinion of the apache video, they had guts, they were on a mission, they did what they felt they needed to do. But from an image standpoint, an image so many of you are protective of, they dropped the ball....but no-one seems to mind, this time.

 

 

transquebecniece wrote:

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In the same circumstances, of either resue (the fallen brother or the snowboarder), what would you have done? Keeping in mind, of course, the heat/passion of the moment—when hindsight is usually 20/20. Just curious, Fen-Fen.

 

 

Chopper_Stew wrote:

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Fen, I don't think you're entirely taking my post in perspective. All I wanted to do was to call attention to the brave work being done by these guys over in the Sandpit. I'm sure no one really thinks about the sacrifices being made and this story was an excellent avenue, especially on this forum, to communicate that. Perhpas we'll leave this post open for discussion by some of the more qualified members such as Cap and Mac, and try to leave the Flight Safety and snowboarder references for a more applicable and productive topic.

 

Cactus,

 

Not one mention of Iraq was made until you chimed in. Thank's for coming out.

 

Cap, Mac, TQN.

 

Thanks.

 

 

Fenestron wrote:

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I had tried to make a post the night before about it, complete with the pictures, but was denied by the censorship rules I am currently involved in. When you made the post, I tried again, and was succesful in trying to make my point. I in no way am knocking these guys for what they did, they did what their hearts told them to do.

 

I'm just trying, and apparently failing to show, that this has similiarities to other videos where people were very vocal about the disasterous consequences. This had all the elements those other videos had, but because of the situation its accepted. Why is a low flying 105 such a faux paus, and an apache flying low level with guys sitting on the sides acceptable? it's beyond me, I don't know what goes on in anybodies head. Someone who see's the differences hasn't explained them much more than "it is what it is" and that's not a good enough answer.

[Kyle]

Fenestron - your topic was removed the night before because of the tone of the message. You were clearly looking for an argument as you are here once again.

 

You are really starting to push it here once again and therefore we have no choice but to preview all of your posts as you very well know. If this is unacceptable to you, I will just close your account permanently.

[transquebecniece]

Someone who see's the differences hasn't explained them much more than "it is what it is" and that's not a good enough answer.

But sometimes...just sometimes..."it is what it is" has to suffice. This I know.

 

Clearly, you won't be seeing this stuff in any ops/flight manuals any time soon (i.e., e-v-e-r). Clearly, lives were put at risk. Clearly, the outcome could've been tragically different. Clearly, these men knew the heart and soul and capabilities of both man and machine. Or were, at the very least, confident in those capabilities. Sometimes, it just doesn't pay to ask "why", but to let it be.

 

All I know is this (and I HAVE experienced it myself, thank you): There are family and friends forever indebted to those who unselfishly took the mother of all risks, with dogged determination, and succeeded.

 

Yes, without success...it would be a completely different story ...and fodder for much heated debate. That is all.

[gwk]

Gee, don,t go banning Fenne. he may not be all that politically correct some of the time, but he sure does keep this forum lively and active.

To me, Fenne, the difference between what your referring to is pretty simple, one, the boys in the B105, 500 are joy riding and putting life and machine at risk for pleasure, or profit.

The other, the rescue mission, is putting life and machine at risk to try and save lives.

To me, a very big difference, one is purely optional and a needless risk, the other is putting one,s life in harms way, to try and save another, with no thought towards profit or reward.

One, we can do without, the other, we can not get enough of.

 

Cheers,

 

GWK

[Elvis]

I agree 100%

[cactus23]

Stew, so why can I not mention Iraq again, something about me chiming up?

I have a nephew over there flying a blackhawk and i have heard enough stories to make most of us cry like babies at night.

[Chopper_Stew]

Stew, so why can I not mention Iraq again, something about me chiming up?

 

Just saying nobody had mentioned Iraq until you brought it up. The article referenced action in southern Afghanistan.

 

Let's try and keep this on track. I realise that these days it's pretty easy for folks to get fired up about the conflicts going on, I just wanted to try and point out the professionalism and courage of the soldiers in the 'ghan because we've stopped hearing about a lot it.

 

(Not that I don't enjoy the odd heated topic as much as the next guy. It get's people thinking, but poor Kyle's going to be run ragged at this pace )

[Murdoch]

I think that'd be a bit loud sitting so close to the air intake for the engines. Wow. Keep all articles of loose clothing secure.

There's a video to go along with this picture? Did that get deleted by mistake too? Shucks, I'd like to see that.

[cactus23]

Stew cheers, point taken, I'll sit back.

[cap]

Fenestron ----your comments are duly noted and the veiled insults were totally unnecessary. The latter was totally unnecessary because I didn't give you cause to do so with a personal attack. If you surmised one from my statements then you have my apology.

 

For me to discuss or debate a civilian rescue compared to a rescue during combat demonstrates only one thing..........that I am wasting my time and that you have the advantge over me. That advantage is that you've been lucky enough to know nothing of combat .....and for that you are to be envied by those such as me and never "talked-down to" because of that ignorance.

 

Chopper_Stew -------you called me "qualified". Soon as someone calls me that it usually means I have to undergo another written test, so careful who you call "qualified"......okay?