Canadian Military Heli Pilots

[Hover Lover]

:down: Today in Iqaluit there were two Griffions parked at the fuel pumps in from of flight services. They got their fuel and just loitered around the ac for about 20 minutes while a Jetranger sat close by with engine running waiting for them to fire up and leave. They then proceeded into the terminal and finally the pilot of the Jetranger gave up and went and parked in another area and shut down. It seemed to those watching that the military pilots owned the apron and felt that they could do whatever they wanted. The pilot of the Jetranger wasted a start up trying to refuel.

Has anyone else been treated this way by military helio pilots or is this just two crews being inconsiderate and unprofessional? They knew the other pilot was waiting to refuel.

Also, they have been flying their Griffions over town at approximately 2-300 feet. That's something that most of us wouldn't do especially since there is not need for it.

These guys are up here for some kind of exercise. There is a frigate and coast guard ship in the harbour and I understand that there may be some jets arriving tomorrow.

So, I was just wondering if anyone has had any experiences or run-ins with guys like these two crews or maybe its just these two crews who were so inconsiderate and unprofessional.

[Jay Flight]

I have had to wait 30min+ here in North Battleford for fuel- same thing they just walk around... one was even riding the cart that the bank run plane uses for loading and unloading the bags... then one Griffion left and after 10 min I got fed up with waiting for the other one... I squeezed the 172 between the pumps and the Griffion and just as I got out as they walked out of the terminal said they where going to need me to move as they just got their IFR clearance, I said I only needed 20 gals it would just be 3 mins! The female pilot said she will move it with the down wash for me..... I pushed it about 4 disks away and then returned and I was airborne as they were calling clear of the zone Thanks ...but I have never had a problem with the training 206's as they are more than willing to wait 10 min+ for the local traffic to be cleared away from the pumps. I wish I had the camera out for the guy getting pushed on the cart as that is what my tax paying $$$ are paying for!!!! too bad he didn't fall on his a@#

[Hazy]

Guys,

 

If you have the tail numbers I can so the research and get you directed in the right direction to place a formal compaint to their squadron's commanding officer. Nobody needs to tolerate that nonsense. Hazeus

[Belcourt]

:down: Today in Iqaluit there were two Griffions parked at the fuel pumps in from of flight services. They got their fuel and just loitered around the ac for about 20 minutes while a Jetranger sat close by with engine running waiting for them to fire up and leave. They then proceeded into the terminal and finally the pilot of the Jetranger gave up and went and parked in another area and shut down. It seemed to those watching that the military pilots owned the apron and felt that they could do whatever they wanted. The pilot of the Jetranger wasted a start up trying to refuel.

Has anyone else been treated this way by military helio pilots or is this just two crews being inconsiderate and unprofessional? They knew the other pilot was waiting to refuel.

Also, they have been flying their Griffions over town at approximately 2-300 feet. That's something that most of us wouldn't do especially since there is not need for it.

These guys are up here for some kind of exercise. There is a frigate and coast guard ship in the harbour and I understand that there may be some jets arriving tomorrow.

So, I was just wondering if anyone has had any experiences or run-ins with guys like these two crews or maybe its just these two crews who were so inconsiderate and unprofessional.

[Belcourt]

:down: Today in Iqaluit there were two Griffions parked at the fuel pumps in from of flight services. They got their fuel and just loitered around the ac for about 20 minutes while a Jetranger sat close by with engine running waiting for them to fire up and leave. They then proceeded into the terminal and finally the pilot of the Jetranger gave up and went and parked in another area and shut down. It seemed to those watching that the military pilots owned the apron and felt that they could do whatever they wanted. The pilot of the Jetranger wasted a start up trying to refuel.

Has anyone else been treated this way by military helio pilots or is this just two crews being inconsiderate and unprofessional? They knew the other pilot was waiting to refuel.

Also, they have been flying their Griffions over town at approximately 2-300 feet. That's something that most of us wouldn't do especially since there is not need for it.

These guys are up here for some kind of exercise. There is a frigate and coast guard ship in the harbour and I understand that there may be some jets arriving tomorrow.

So, I was just wondering if anyone has had any experiences or run-ins with guys like these two crews or maybe its just these two crews who were so inconsiderate and unprofessional.

 

Similar incidents have happened to me over the years. There is a lack of understanding the commercial world on the part of the military personnel, not to mention lack of courtesy. I once "hopped' over a 212 to the pump in Williams Lake since they were still walking around their 212 wondering how they could get airborne with only four four people looking at the ground. A young chap walked up to me to complain and I told him to help me with refuelling so that I could get out of their way. I have a lot of respect for the F-18 pilots, but the helicopter jockeys are a joke. Who trains those guys and what are they actually doing for us?

[ame206350]

Kind off off topic but a CH146 landed at our hangar a few weeks back. Even with a spotter the pilot took 3 tries just to get it on the pad (no exaggeration whatsoever). Kept having the bear paws off the pad and generally just having a hard time hitting anywhere near the center of the pad. Pretty sad performance - must have been embarrassing for the pilot. Kind of made me wonder what was up with that as pretty much any commercial pilot would have hit it the first time. I guess those 412's must be really hard to hover. How much training does the average military heli pilot get? Is the guy that can't even hit a huge flat pad the guy we want doing our business in a warzone or disaster area? I'll take a Canadian bush pilot any day of the week.

[gwk]

I,ve got about 4000 hours in the 412, and although they are a hand full cross wind, because of a very demanding t/r, you can land them on a dime, just like any other heli.

I would guess that the poor pilot was low time, and after the 1st attempt failed, was getting abit intimidated when he could not place the bear paws.

I would give them all a bit of credit, because like us, regardless of what you do with them, we,re all quite capable, it,s just our particular fields are different than theirs, and I know I would look pretty silly trying to attempt some of the #### they do.

Saying that, there is no excuse for hogging the space at the pumps, that is just poor airmanship, and deserves constructive word or two.

 

Cheers

[Helilog56]

Well, my take on this is simple.....an assh*le is an assh*le, wether civilian, military or private.

 

I've seen similar performances by "all" types...... :down:

 

Obviously "courtesy" is becoming a thing of the past.....

[volition]

Well, my take on this is simple.....an assh*le is an assh*le, wether civilian, military or private.

 

I've seen similar performances by "all" types...... :down:

 

Obviously "courtesy" is becoming a thing of the past.....

 

100% in accord!!!

 

As for F18 or helicopter pilots, you don't join the military to build hours, F18 or helicopters!! At least not the Canadian one!

[canukav8tor]

Folks, there is no justification for military pilots to conduct themselves any differently/less courteously than civilian pilots when fuelling, parking, manoeuvring, etc...

 

That said, if you do experience something like this, you should feel justified to address your concerns with the crew(s). If the crew(s) does/do not conduct themselves in a profession manner, you should disengage, record the aircraft's registration, then contact the unit that the crew belongs to -- I would recommend contacting the FSS/FIC and ask for the crew's unit contact information in the remarks section of the their flightplan: i.e. OPR// 4## Sqn Ops, (###) ###-####. Then either directly or via you Company Ops Manager, contact the squadron and address your concerns. The Commanding Officer will waste no time in sorting his crew out.

 

Some military pilots do not get a lot of experience operating in and around civilan aerodreoms, and there are things that they may not consider that you may take for granted as a "should know". Even with thousands of hours in the military, I learned a lot during my first week flying commercial. That's one issue, being ignorant is another -- that's inexcusable.

 

Regarding capabilities, not everyone can drop a coffee can in a bucket with a 150' long line -- just as not everybody can put LEA pers on a moving/evading vessel on heaving seas in the middle of the night on NVGs, or avoid RPG/small arms fire flying over the Red Desert south of Kandahar.

 

Everyone has to start somewhere -- it takes about 2 years of accumulated flight time to make a 15,000 hour pilot...

 

 

Regards,

AV8TOR