Issues Affecting Canadian Industry?

[Mike Reyno]

Cyclic Monkey,

 

 

My post was purely to create some discussion to learn a bit more about some of the issues that are affecting the industry in general so when I DO call on the operators and regulators next week, I can have a bit more understanding of some of the real issues instead of trying to talk out of the side of my mouth.

 

So, yes this is a search for information for a story that will be appearing in an up-coming issue. Isn’t this the stuff you want to read about? I’d be more than happy to quote you though Cyclic Monkey if you have any thing you would like to provide!

[Blackmac]

Mike: Nomex pretty well hit the nail on the head with his post. I am aware of the 12,000hr pilot that the contract was written for (Fort Simpson) I believe. I asked the person from wildlife what would happen to his requirement if the person he made the scope of work just had a heart attack. His response was, "I'll take anybody with bird catching experience".

 

With the advent of GPS, which is a requirement I put in government contracts over ten years ago. The people I trained and the person presently in charge of that section try and be fair and actually make the scope of work as fair as possible.

 

As far as rates are concerned the contract is awarded to the low bidder meeting all the requiremnts of the RFP. That department has to live by those rules.

 

National Transportation Agency in 1987 elected to deregulate the industry and was a big mistake IMHO.

 

Transport Canada continues to put helicpters in the same category as the "Air Taxi" industry. If Transport hasn't noticed I see very few Air Taxi operators which the regs are written for actually operating vertical lift aircraft.

 

The HELICOPTER INDUSTRY HAS ALWAYS BEEN UNIQUE AND THE ONLY PEOPLE THAT DO NOT KNOW THIS IS TRANSPORT CANADA.

 

PLEASE MAKE REGULATIONS APPLICABLE TO THE HELICOPTER INDUSTRY AS A SEPERATE ENTITY.

 

Speaking for the helicopter industry it should be re-regulated to get rid of the shady operators, advise all government departments to write thier scope of work around the company the meets all requirements with respect to safety, providing the properly equipped helicopter, pilot qualifications based on the companies recommendation for the work to be carried out, (no minimums hours as presently stated) (in accordance with all government contracts,there is a clause that if the pilot is not qualified he must be repelaced at the company cost, which could include down time), the hourly rate and minimums are the last item that should be considered.

 

De-regulation allows the CLIENT not only to play the operators agianst one another, but also allows the CLIENT to actaually have a say in how the pilot and helicopter will perform thier duties.

 

NTA is the only agency capable of re-regulating the industry and not under "Air Taxi" operations. The industry can be re-regulated ("RULES") without having to change hourly rates on an ongoing basis.

 

The "Rules and Regulations" would have to be written into every contract, the minimums that must be charged must be written into every contract and the hourly rate that is charged must be a minmum of 10% of the market value of the helicopter using current blue book value.

 

MINIMUMS SHOULD BE AS FOLLOWS: (Long and Short Term Contracts)

 

Long Term: 3 hr per day averaged over the period of the contract (more than 30 days)

 

Short Term: 4 hr per day, averaged over the period if more than seven days and less than thirty. This would be in effect from 1 June to 31 August

 

 

Basing Charges would apply on contracts exceeding two months but would be calculated as follows;

 

Basing Charge: $xxxxx per 30 days (must be equal to 3hr/day minus maintenance charge)

 

Hourly Maint Charge for every hour flown up to 90hr/mo: $xxxxx

 

Hourly Maint. Charge for all hours flown in excess of the averaged minimums over the period of the contract: $_________ (more hours flown costs increase)

 

NOTE: The purpose of the basing charge is to allow the client a possible saving of the maintenance charges that are not incurred by the operator if the calculated minimum hours are not flown.

 

This an un-ending story as far the industry is concerned and just some of the problems we will be lobbying for when we get into action.

 

People are free to add their own thoughts, actually they are welcomed.

 

HELICOPTER ENGINEERS AND PILOTS ASSOCIATION, CANADA

[cyclic monkey]

Ned and Mike, my apologies to you both as you seemed to misunderstand the subtle tone of humour in my post. It was intended to elicit the type of responses that we got from the other regulars on this site.

If the boys don't tease you........then you'll know you've lost their respect.

Good luck on your respective trips to operators next week. Keep up the good work.

[walterheneghan]

I think that it is time for a magazine to do a layout dealing with the Human Resource and Canada Labour Code issues that dog our industry. How pilots get paid, abuse of "banked time" by companies, stat and holiday pay. Management pressures to fly past CAR's limits...in effect, a "b@llsy" article about the nastier side of the industry and the types of things that employers do to nickle and dime their employees (pilots and AME's).

 

So there... :hide:

[Over-Talk]

WalterH, good idea, but the editors might not get too "ballsy" against the companies that pay for advertising in their magazines.

 

There are some companies out there that treat their staff excellently. Maybe a story about these companies will help to pull up the standards of the others.

 

As always, if something stinks in this business, please use the Confidential Reporting Service of the TSB. They would rather read your report, and act on it, than see you have an accident and then have to write a report on you.

 

http://www.tsb.gc.ca/en/securitas/index.asp

[Big Duke 6]

Blackmac, no disrepect, I'm only trying to play the devil's advocate in my response. The statement you made regarding the "industry" I think is a little too presumptious.

- "Speaking for the helicopter industry it should be re-regulated to get rid of the shady operators, advise all government departments to write thier scope of work around the company the meets all requirements with respect to safety, providing the properly equipped helicopter, pilot qualifications based on the companies recommendation for the work to be carried out."

What gives you that right on a public forum? As for de-regulation, that was put in place to try and create a more open playing field, buy incouraging free enterprize based on common buisness practices throughout the rest of the aviation world. Thus operators that weren't innovative and couldn't compete were effectively eliminated. Unfortunatly some of them have very deep pockets and continue to plague the industry. Given enough time they too, will go the way of so many before them. As for the client, they must have a say in the type of helicopter required, and the qulification's of the pilot. They are after all, the people that are providing the work. However that DOES NOT allow operators to neglect there obligation to CARS, the Canada Labour Code, and other regulatory bodies governing buisness in this country.... As for HEPAC lobbing industry to dictate "operator" contracts, that's what HAC is for.

Don't take this the wrong way.... I do beleive in an association that looks after the concerns of pilots and engineers. I'am only playing the devils advocate because I personally don't what to see HEPAC loose there focus, by tackling issues that are far reaching, and will consume all of your hard work and time. HAC is there to work in conjuction with operators and Transport Canada to better address the issues faced by the helicopter industry and the regulations that effect vertical flight only.

As for Ned and Mike's magazines I think they are an invaluable tool for our industry and encourage them to keep doing what there doin'. :up:

 

This again, is only my humble opinion.

Cheers, BD6.

[twinstar_ca]

is it not also an issue for you guys in the development of the new drivers coming up?? these guys spend a whack of $$$ to get the licence and then comes the road trips that we read about and hear how much perseverance and attitude is needed and how long it can take to get that foot in the door...

 

there is no formal incentive to an employer to hire the low timers and develop them into acceptable risks to the insurance/clients/etc...

 

in an ideal world, HRDC should be able to make some kind of financial incentive to the owners/operators to bring these guys and girls on and groom them for their operations... there will also need to be accountability on the part of the operator to use those incentives for the purpose they were intended...

[tDawe]

I’m surprised that no one has mentioned Insurance yet. Could it be that costs really are coming down? Forgive me if I don't hold my breath. Insurance may not be that interesting to read about it, but I'm sure all the low timers out there are very interested in knowing whether its becoming more feasible to insure them on the company bird.

[HeloTeacher]

is it not also an issue for you guys in the development of the new drivers coming up?? these guys spend a whack of $$$ to get the licence and then comes the road trips that we read about and hear how much perseverance and attitude is needed and how long it can take to get that foot in the door...

 

there is no formal incentive to an employer to hire the low timers and develop them into acceptable risks to the insurance/clients/etc...

 

in an ideal world, HRDC should be able to make some kind of financial incentive to the owners/operators to bring these guys and girls on and groom them for their operations... there will also need to be accountability on the part of the operator to use those incentives for the purpose they were intended...

The constant talks about attitude are needed because so many students go to the schools with the attitude that a licence should and will guarantee them employment. There is a need to educate them on this. A diploma or degree doesn't quarantee a job any more than a licence or anything else. People are hired when they are deemed to be an asset to the organization.

 

The advantage to hire low-time help is the reduced costs of emplyment. More experienced pilots demand higher wages, pretty simple.

 

Further incentives, long term employee loyalty, are foreign to aviation because the same operators that fly the types accessable by low-time pilots soon lose their shine in the eyes of these pilots. They look up to new types and disappear as soon as they can.

 

Its a bitter cycle but we are as much to blame as the employers.

[Blackmac]

Big Duke: You have the advantage of knowing who I am and with all due respect, I lived through Canadian Transportation Commission and was the one at Viking responsible for filing tariff's.

 

The depression started in 1982 and then deregulation in 1987, I started working for the government in 1988 dealing only with Air Charters on both flingwing and stiffwing. I dealt with most operators across Canada and know the results that de-regulation had and still has on the industry.

 

De-regulation was fine for the stiff wing part of the "Air Taxi" as it reflected more on passenger revenue and cargo on selected routes. Not so for the helicopter industry, we are a totally different, we do not have selected routes.

 

Would you please tell me what HAC has done for engineers and pilots and or the helicopter industry in relation to rates, which reflect the pay of engineers and pilots.

 

The story of rates goes back to the days of when helicopter people would meet agree to raise rates and then as soon as the meeting was over call there office and lower rates. That was the days of CTC and you could only change your tariff on 48 hr notice.

 

In reality in todays so-called free market that we have been living with since 1987 has resulted in what?????? PLEASE ADVISE.

 

My suggestion on re-regulating the industry starting of with minimums and a minimum hourly rate based on the value or whatever is much like an auction with a reserve minimum bid. Then the operator would be getting value for his investment and in return be able to pay reasonable salaries to his crews and afford insurance for low time pilots.

 

That is exactly what was happening before de-regulation.

 

Agree or disagree is your option.

 

Cheers HEPAC