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The Real Batman...you just don't get it man...

I don’t begrudge Cpl Jennings his medal....I wasn’t there when he flew the mission....A snowstorm indicates reduced vis, but he got the job done. I know I’ve flown when I should not have
In your own words, you weren't there so who do you think you are to pass judegement on that mission. :( Give it up by and congradulate da by'. We'll forgive you for crappin' on him!!

 

407 Driver...good post...you too WG!! :up:

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Very interesting thread. "When to go and when to draw the line on a life"

 

Remember a accident in the George River some years ago when a gentlemen I had met just a day or two before perished with him and his whole crew on board while trying to save a life.

 

Was he a cowboy or a hero seeker, I guaruntee you not. He was a man with a heart who had a very dificult descion to make. Sadly things went wrong, and unfortunalety things do go wrong in this business on occasion.

 

Some talked of proffesionalism.............well that sir is making the call and hoping it is the correct one.

 

With regard to violations, rule book pretty much goes out the window. Now before some of you start beating me for this comment, I said rule book not common sense. So show me a guy that is 200 nautical out to sea, has 5 guys out of the dingy and will not hoist the six (last) guy because it is going to put him 20kg over gross.

 

I do not know Dwayne, but here's to ya, and like 407 said there are 1000's others out there, and well done to them.

 

Merry Christmas

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There was a situation in Valemount a few years ago. A small plane went down and the Military located it. They decided to sling a Sar Tech into the site using an unqualified Pilot from a local operator. Sar Tech and Pilot were awarded Gov Gen medals. The Sar Tech for enduring a "wild swinging ride" and the pilot for not killing him I guess.

Two qualified Mtn Rescue Pilots were based 45mins away in Golden. 

 

All of us have to guard ourselves from making heat of the moment decisions that could backfire with tragic results.

 

End of Rant...

Excuse me folks, I don’t mean to sidetrack this thread, but Mr. (Ms.?) Stickjiggler’s rant contains a few inaccuracies and his/her concluding statement seems to suggest that maybe the folks in Valemount tend to act without thinking.

 

1. There was no “slinging” involved, at least not in the context of the mountain rescue system. It was a fairly straight-forward rappel operation which the pilot was qualified to carry out.

 

2. As far as the “wild swinging ride” goes, you may wish to confirm the accuracy of your information as quite often the media tends to enhance a story to make for a good read.

 

3. Maybe 407D can help us out here, but the last time I checked I'm pretty sure it's about 140NM from Golden to Valemount and not even a 407 is that fast! Given the Wx that particular evening, I seriously doubt that the “qualified Mtn Rescue Pilots” would have even made it to Valemount. Even if the Wx had been ideal, they would not have made it in time to mount any kind of rescue effort as it would have been well past grounding time. If memory serves, the SARtechs involved believed that the victims would probably have perished due to exposure if not due to the nature of their injuries had they not been able to get into the site that night.

 

There’s nearly always more to these stories than any of us are aware of. Stickjiggler, it's really not worth getting that worked up about.

 

I personally know several mountain rescue pilots (past and present). I would have to say that as a group they are not in the rescue business for the recognition but I would also like to say that they all definitely deserve it.

 

To Cpl. Jennings and also to the crew of the news chopper….congratulations, and well done!

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Gee, stay away from the forum for a day, and all **** breaks loose!

 

Blackmac: Please refer to me to the document that indicates that “TC regs are not written in stone, they are there to protect the public from operators that are making a buck from breaking the minimums.” I assume from your statement that we can pick and choose which regs we will obey in any given situation as long as we are not making a buck. Of course to that I say “Baloney”!

 

Whirlygirl: Fair enough.

 

407 Driver: It’s not the fact that Cpl. Jennings received the recognition, and I hope that’s not what is being taken from what I am saying. I knew that my initial comment was going send a flurry of hand grenades in my direction, but the event seemed like a good way to get the conversation going! It concerns me, especially now seeing the comments being thrown out here, that there are some serious misunderstandings about what we do with helicopters. Just because we are pilots, and have a certain set of skills, doesn’t mean we should be using those skills carte blanche. And the CAR’s are an excellent guide to keep us from playing hero. Just because you can, doesn’t mean you should.

 

LongRanger: A pilot with over 30 years experience. If I had not experienced the real life situations that we’re talking about here – including recognition from the same employer as Cpl Jennings, I would have kept my mouth shut. The part that is worrying me is how some people seem to think that we should be rewarding pilots for doing things that we should not be doing. Now,... do you get it?

 

RDM: This is the attitude that scares me. If you want to create an example at least think of one that compares. Leaving the tarmac knowing the weather is below VFR minimums, BECAUSE YOU ARE GOING TO SAVE SOMEONE’S LIFE, is not at all the same as arriving at a scene 200 nm from shore to discover a passenger puts you 20 kgs over gross. Get it?

 

####: Understood. It’s not the medal that this is all about – but it sure proved the catalyst to get this conversation going!

 

Bleed air: I want to agree with the last paragraph of Stickjiggler’s ‘rant’. We do have to guard ourselves from making heat of the moment decisions that could backfire with tragic results.

 

Human life is precious. I see it come and go every day I go to work. The CAR’s are there for a reason. They take away the decision when the requirements are not met. There are NO weather visibility exceptions, including life saving. Professional pilots recognize that. Cowboys don’t. If you, as God’s gift to aviation, choose to ignore them, then make sure you are risking YOUR life, not someone else’s.

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Leaving the tarmac knowing the weather is below VFR minimums, BECAUSE YOU ARE GOING TO SAVE SOMEONE’S LIFE, is not at all the same as arriving at a scene 200 nm from shore to discover a passenger puts you 20 kgs over gross. Get it?

 

No I am sorry I do not "get it". Below VFR limits and 20 kgs over weight are the same thing are they not. :hide:

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RDM...right on brudder, right on!! :up: I'm some glad I had you as an instructor!! :P

 

Batman....no I don't get it, whatever it is you are trying to say. I see some flip flopping now :huh: . I commend you for your 30 years experience. I'm sure you have knowledge to pass on. All these replies started with a couple of hands throwing comments about weather limits and regs that may not have even been a factor that day. I hope the comments tossed out were not from rumors. Sorry I don't get it!! :blink: Stunned maybe!!

 

BTW Batman...would the commendation you refer to be from a flight out of Corner Brook, Newfoundland?? B)

 

Simply put....show us the METAR and TAF for that day and area and I'll withdraw from this topic. Otherwise let it go before we start throwing rocks!! :D;)

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just for record, if anyone wants to take a look at www.alea.org website, go to the photo albums, find the RCMP and you can have a look at 3 pics of another operation cpl jennings was involved in...

 

i still say good on him, let him enjoy his commendation and i sure hope the tone of this thread hasn't soured it for him... :unsure:

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Congradulation's Cpl Jennings and all other crews that have particapated in SAR missions resulting in "saving a life" :up: . Obviously there was risk involved in that mission. He is however, a police officer which mandates him to protect the public's safety as responsibly as he can. He obviously viewed and weighed that risk and found it acceptable thus the "Heroism Medal". But I'm sure, like most of the professional rescue pilots that I now, they are some of the most unassuming, quiet and reserved professionals in the industry, who intentially try and avoid recognition. The fact that people ("Fellow Professionals", and I say that with alot of hesitation after reading some of these posts.) are trying to disstain, and dishearten the fact that somebody's recognoizing there efforts, I think looks very poorly on all of us as Pro's. You can't play the monday morning quarterback, after the fact.

 

Get over it, and move on Gentlemen. It won't be last time somebody takes calculated risk to save a life. ;)

 

Again, just my humble opinion.

Duke VI.

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