How Silly Are We?

[amodao]

For those who feel the need to again point out the differences between an union and an association please feel free. I hope this new and improved association will include specialized training on how to overstate the obvious, cause it seems like a lot of people require some "S"pecial "H"igh "I"ntensity "T"raining on this subject.

[transquebecniece]

...looking at the two existing aviation "associations" I currently deal with (neither of which I put any effort into admitedly), one grass roots and one considered "professional", I see very little reason to support them any more than I currently do.

Different associations offer different benefits and indeed, you get back out what you put in. Networking is work. Many people simply don't need or want to network with others. To each his/her own.

 

I hope this new and improved association will include specialized training on how to overstate the obvious, cause it seems like a lot of people require some "S"pecial "H"igh "I"ntensity "T"raining on this subject.

I'd use that for a new signature, even if you were being facetious, Amodao—but I like your first one better. Thx again!

 

(Apologies to Frequent Flyer for contributing to hijack. If I get time, I'll research some U.S. contract rates for you.)

[amodao]

I will try better next time! :up:

[transquebecniece]

You come up with some real doozies! :up: You're a natural!

[hybrid]

Hi Guys and Girls,

 

I have just been chatting with some friends who have been working in Australia this summer and I was amazed at some of the figures being thrown around for charter and pilot rates down there. By comparison we really are close too the bottom of the scale on the money end of things. It a little disheartening really. Here are a few of the major things we picked up on.

 

1) All Australian Operators that we spoke to bill on Engine time. Not Hobbs time. This gives the operators a 15 to 20% margin for their operations. Be it Government or private sector it all begins when you hit the starter. The way it should be.

 

2) Most charter rates are at least 10 to 20% higher than that of Canada. a) Robinson 44 - $820 / hour. Bell 206 - $1100 / hour Bell 205 - 13 - $3000 / hour

Bell212 - $3300 / hour

 

3) I have the pay scales from two different companies down here. Both in Fire fighting operations with one branching out into the Heli Logging market overseas. The full time guys do 2 weeks on 2 weeks off. With some doing 4 weeks on and 2 off. What money I hear you ask? $ 450 a day and $150 an hour. This is no bull@#$*.

 

So my question here is an age old one. Did we miss the boat or do we think as an industry we can pull it together and start making what we should be making. Not just me as a pilot but the companies that employ us. Your thaughts would be appreciated.

 

Cheers

[Frequent Flyer]

Thanks Trans,

 

I would like to get back on topic and see some other opinions out there. Do we in Canada think that these types of pay scales and machine rates are out of reach. Especially in the short term. Can you imagine a 205 fetching $3000 per hour to move drills. Or a 212 for the same rate. I personally think it is out of reach for us in the present condition the industry is in. And as for $450 a day and $150 an hour. I can only dream of the day.

[fly_boyz]

Fly_boys:

...

You did not read TQN's remarks about a union or an association.

 

...

 

Well, I did in fact read every response. I certainly understand the difference between a union and an association. I am not opposed to an association which is why in my post I did not say anything negative about the idea or even discuss it. My comment regarding my hesitation abbout unions was clearly an asside because the conversation wondered off topic. My main point was that it is possible to manage your career, make good money and enjoy the company you work for and that there are some of us out there that don't complain.

 

Oh, and by the way, most companies I have worked for charge their clients flight time (not air time). Really though, I think most pilots are 'flexible' when it comes to billing in the field, and most of those companies left it up to us to decide how we charged the client.

[transquebecniece]

Just for you, Frequent Flyer. Don't know if this is helpful or not, but scroll down to Exhibit 12 on this link.

 

http://72.14.203.104/search?q=cache:JSJkPx...us&ct=clnk&cd=4

[transquebecniece]

Sorry. Should've said those are contract rates related to firefighting.

[MINI]

Well I dont know about the rest of you people,but Im getting 3300.00 @ hr. for my 205 and 3369.00 for my 212 :up: :up:

 

Have a good weekend all and I just love Ladies who drink beer from a bottle.

Inside Joke.....Mini...